4WABS: is it worth it? - Ford Bronco Forum
 
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post #1 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-02-2017, 02:06 PM Thread Starter
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4WABS: is it worth it?

This is for all you Post-SAS rigs out there, because you guys probably have more experience with this than most.

So im going 8-lug on this 96 I recently acquired (thread). Because it doesn't have a motor, ill never get to drive it 'stock'. So I honestly have no idea how the 4WABS system works, if its decent or junk. (this is the first 4WABS vehicle ive ever owned)

Im getting ready to start the 8-lug conversion to the TTB, and I think I see a way (with access to a lathe) to make the 4WABS functional again. But I don't know if its worth doing?? I ditched the RABS on my 88 when I went one-ton, and the RABS on my 96 F250 is only sub-par, doubt id miss it if it was gone.

I was looking at my EVTM and it looks like the ABS Hyd Module & ECM is a stand-alone system not tied into the PCM. So im thinking the module can be removed from the frame, and I can replumb the brakes. Then im thinking unplug and toss the ABS ECM, and problem solved. But, I don't know if this causes other problems, or if it will pop a CEL. I know if I simply leave the sensors unplugged itll pop the ABS light, and im trying to avoid that. If im ditching the system, id rather rip it all out, then just remove the bulb from the dash.

So I guess I have a couple questions:

1st, does the 4WABS actually work decently in these trucks?
2nd, if I remove the 4WABS module & ECM, will the PCM know and pop a CEL? Or is there some wiring mods I need to do?
3rd, those of you that did a SAS and ditched the 4WABS, do you miss it? (im thinking you don't)

Right now im in the process of stripping the TTB to begin the rebuild on it which is the perfect time to do all the mods to keep the 4WABS. And, with no motor under the hood either, its the perfect time to re-plumb the brake system and ditch the 4WABS. So yeah, either way, one of these things it hopefully gonna happen this week
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post #2 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-02-2017, 04:42 PM
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heres an issue you might consider. actually adding an tone ring to the Chevy hub. one from the bronco might not be able to fit. with some machining you could probably make a groove on the hub for it but you need to find a ring big enough to fit over it at about the right size. possibly using a E-250/350 toner ring might be useable. otherwise you can do like what people do for the rear VSS relocation and get a gear from tractor supple, then lathe the center out big enough to fit over the hub

do you plan on using a rear axle with a VSS?

what is your plan for 8-lugging the TTB? using chevy parts? that 96 steering knuckles will use 5-bolt instead of the 6-bolt needed. not that you cant drill new holes but jsut a heads up

instead of using Chevy parts to convert to 8-lug, ive been planning a way of using Dana50/44HD TTB parts form a TTB F250. may be more strong and easier to find parts. lathe the center bore big enough and drill new holes for the D50 spindle. still have to cut the caliper ears off and would need to make backing plate. if i recall correctly, Dana50 and Dana60 use the same spindle bolt pattern, they may sell backing plates for front D60 that will work with some mods
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as for the 4WABS being worthy? maybe is snow or wet roads. i forgot about 4WABS. my current 96 doesn't work at the moment. my previous 96 hasnt worked since i did balljoints for the first time. its been a long time. you will probably need new sensors which arnt very cheap. other than that it may not be hard to make it work


-----96 5.0 E4OD--------------88 5.8 C6--------------96 5.8 E4OD------
---------KIA-------------------Mud/Trail---------------Daily Driver------
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post #3 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-02-2017, 04:56 PM
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only connection to the PCM is that it shared the connection to the BOO (Brake on/off sensor). to delete it you would have to make a pair of jumpers for the PSOM signals






-----96 5.0 E4OD--------------88 5.8 C6--------------96 5.8 E4OD------
---------KIA-------------------Mud/Trail---------------Daily Driver------
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post #4 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-02-2017, 08:05 PM
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Yo K,
In 92 through 96, the rear axle mounted VSS provides a 72,900 to 86,900 pulses per mile signal via the 4WABS module to the Programmable Speedometer/Odometer Module (PSOM) ; PSOM converts this signal to 8,000 pulses per mile. That signal is sent out to the PCM and then to:
E4OD,

speed control amplifier;
and overhead consoles compass/outside temperature display module, if equipped. Overhead console module uses the PSOM signal to estimate the accuracy of the outside temperature sensor that uses a high-speed counter to monitor vehicle speed to determine whether engine heat is causing erroneous readings.

If you keep the PCM and 8.8 mounted VSS sensor, but remove the 4WABS Module you will need to jumper the module connector as described below.

4WABS Control Module Bypass for PSOM Operation due to Bad 4WABS Control Module at 4WABS Module Connector; "...jumper 14 (CKT 530, LG/Y)to 21 (CKT 519 (LG/BK) & 39 (CKT 491 (O/LB)to 22 (CKT 523, R/PK)..."
Source: by Turbo Ghost at VSS speedo question

4WABS Control Module Removal in 93-96; "...Disconnect the plug from it, remove the 10mm bolt holding it in and slide it out of the keyway"
Source: by Froggmann (Ken P)

Or keep the 4WABS System, but, install a 4WABS Cut-Off Switch as Froggmann (Ken P) did;
https://web.archive.org/web/20080907...o/Tech/ABS.htm
EXCERPT; "... Those of you who have 93-96 broncos have pobbibly come across this problem, your going down a washboard road and suddenly have to hit the brakes. No matter how hard or light you hit the brakes you don't seem to stop. Or your on a little expedition in some sand or snow, and you suddenly get stuck enough where your tires are spinning, you hit your brakes so you can put your truck into park without blowing apart the star and lo and behold your F$*@ing ABS turns on not allowing your wheels to stop until 5 minutes later. Fun isn't it? Exactly, its a pain in the patutski isn't it. Now for those of you who use their late model broncos for daily driving know that the ABS, when your on pavement, works pretty dammed good. But, it can be deadly on the trail. Now, some of you have figured out how to disable it, and others are wondering how to disable it. This page will tell you how by a flick of a switch..." read more

We and many other 93 through 96 Bronco owners have had the modules puke the microprocessers. I went through two yard queen modules, but they were bad. So I jumpered it out. Others had the Hydraulic Control Unit fail.

See my partially recovered Bronco web site ...Will need to clean up dead links & add many more new links some day. Thanks to Mr. Schwim!
THANKS to ALL WHO SERVE!

Last edited by miesk5; 01-02-2017 at 08:06 PM. Reason: Saving space
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post #5 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-03-2017, 01:06 AM
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I don't think I would want abs on a rig I take off road
I have read many horror stories where guys have crashed going down hill because the brakes did not stop them because one or more wheels was sliding in mud and not rotating and the brakes kept backing off

I personally hate abs
it has its place, but I still hate it
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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-03-2017, 01:19 AM
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i replumbed mine directly from the mc to the front and rear, pulled the hcu and pulled the fuse for abs after my sas. everything works fine, no problems with speedometer or the e4od. also a daily driver, the stock ttb brakes i had were in pretty bad shape so in my case the brakes work better now.

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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-03-2017, 02:51 AM Thread Starter
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I'm at work right now so bear with me

Kingfish,
I already have all the parts to go 8 lug on the TTB. Chevy parts with an older set of knuckles.

The Ford D44 tone ring will fit on the Chevy hub if I machine the hub. Then the caliper bracket will require a small mod. Then drill hole thru knuckle and spindle for the sensor and done. I have pics at home that I can add to this thread later on today to show what needs to be done, it doesn't seem that bad to do. But, I'll need access to a lathe to do it.

Replacement sensors are on RockAuto for ~$30 so not too bad to replace them.

Miesk,
You are the man. I spent quite some time reading thru the archives but never found that post showing which pins to jumper out. So it is feasible to completely remove the system.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-04-2017, 12:18 PM
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To answer the question simply, no it's not worth it. It's a good system for on street driving. But snow and offroad situations it sucks. Before I went to a 60 up front I had a switch so I could turn off the ABS when it was snowing or when I was wheeling.
Now having just rear abs I don't mind it at all and no longer have a shutoff switch for it.
So I say don't bother with it.

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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-04-2017, 01:46 PM
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Not worth the trouble to keep. I pulled all mine out when I did my 60 swap. I didn't re pin or make jumpers either. I just unplugged and removed the abs pump and computer. No CEL but I do have a abs light. Going to pull the bulb but haven't done it yet. On a side note I am running a F-350 computer in mine.


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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-04-2017, 02:02 PM
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I like rear ABS due to it keeps the rear end tracking strait in a panic stop. Front not so much, I like good solid stops without a computer telling me I can't.
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post #11 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-04-2017, 05:18 PM
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you never seen the picture of bypassing the VSS signal? this is how you determin if the module is the cause of no speedometer. it doesnt need the 4WABS for anything else


-----96 5.0 E4OD--------------88 5.8 C6--------------96 5.8 E4OD------
---------KIA-------------------Mud/Trail---------------Daily Driver------
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post #12 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-05-2017, 04:24 AM
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Your question is 4WABS worth it? I'm wondering after your 8 lug conversion, are you going to sas? I live in commiefornia where you can't have a cel or any light on the dash illuminated to get the bi-annual smog test done. I kept my 4WABS when I did my sas. I put it on a 79 dana 60 axle. I used the WFO brake brackets that use a duramax brakes and had the hubs machined to use a dynatrac tone ring. This setup cost me about $950 on top of the price of the axle. I went this route to keep the 8x6.5 lug pattern. Another route that would work to keep ABS on the front axle is getting a pair of super-duty axles that has ABS part of it. You get the ABS and rear disc and probably cost less then a kingpin 60.

Now back to the original question. If you don't need to keep you setup stockish because of the state you live in and you don't want to convert to 8x170 lug pattern, then no its not worth the cost and pain in the butt to make it work.
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post #13 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-05-2017, 12:12 PM Thread Starter
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No functioning ABS is not a requirement of PA inspection. No real plan for SASing this one; I already have two SASed Fords don't need a third lol


So the general consensus of this thread is that its not worth the effort to make the ABS work. Which is the direction I was leaning anyway. So looks like ill remove the whole thing and replumb the brakes while the motor is out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingfish999 View Post
you never seen the picture of bypassing the VSS signal? this is how you determin if the module is the cause of no speedometer. it doesnt need the 4WABS for anything else
Yeah I ended up finding that pic in one of the threads miesk linked. I intend to use it to bypass the 4WABS, and then eliminate the entire pigtail going to the ECM. Goal is once its done, no one will be able to tell anything is missing.
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post #14 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-05-2017, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Turd View Post
Your question is 4WABS worth it? I'm wondering after your 8 lug conversion, are you going to sas? I live in commiefornia where you can't have a cel or any light on the dash illuminated to get the bi-annual smog test done. I kept my 4WABS when I did my sas. I put it on a 79 dana 60 axle. I used the WFO brake brackets that use a duramax brakes and had the hubs machined to use a dynatrac tone ring. This setup cost me about $950 on top of the price of the axle. I went this route to keep the 8x6.5 lug pattern. Another route that would work to keep ABS on the front axle is getting a pair of super-duty axles that has ABS part of it. You get the ABS and rear disc and probably cost less then a kingpin 60.

Now back to the original question. If you don't need to keep you setup stockish because of the state you live in and you don't want to convert to 8x170 lug pattern, then no its not worth the cost and pain in the butt to make it work.
You can pull the SAS light indicator from the dash, believe that is what I did

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post #15 of 15 (permalink) Old 01-06-2017, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingfish999 View Post
heres an issue you might consider. actually adding an tone ring to the Chevy hub. one from the bronco might not be able to fit. with some machining you could probably make a groove on the hub for it but you need to find a ring big enough to fit over it at about the right size. possibly using a E-250/350 toner ring might be useable. otherwise you can do like what people do for the rear VSS relocation and get a gear from tractor supple, then lathe the center out big enough to fit over the hub

do you plan on using a rear axle with a VSS?

what is your plan for 8-lugging the TTB? using chevy parts? that 96 steering knuckles will use 5-bolt instead of the 6-bolt needed. not that you cant drill new holes but jsut a heads up

instead of using Chevy parts to convert to 8-lug, ive been planning a way of using Dana50/44HD TTB parts form a TTB F250. may be more strong and easier to find parts. lathe the center bore big enough and drill new holes for the D50 spindle. still have to cut the caliper ears off and would need to make backing plate. if i recall correctly, Dana50 and Dana60 use the same spindle bolt pattern, they may sell backing plates for front D60 that will work with some mods
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as for the 4WABS being worthy? maybe is snow or wet roads. i forgot about 4WABS. my current 96 doesn't work at the moment. my previous 96 hasnt worked since i did balljoints for the first time. its been a long time. you will probably need new sensors which arnt very cheap. other than that it may not be hard to make it work
Thats the only time i didnt like my 4wabs, wet roads. I didnt miss it on my bronco, and i removed rabs on my 250

1995 red xlt sport! with 351
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