4x4 low range problem [Archive] - FSB Forums

: 4x4 low range problem


m1e1w1
11-11-2010, 09:43 AM
I searched first, found out some things to test on my truck before posting. Hereís what Iím left with:

I have a 93' bronco EB. It has the auto 4 wheel transfer case, borg warner. However the hubs are manual lock (converted by previous owner?)

randomly 4x4 low range lights up while driving (drive position) I donít switch to neutral first or park to engage 4 wheel high, the hubs are unlocked (show unlocked position) while the indicator is on, I hear a constant click / knock sound on the front driver side of the truck, at low speeds about 1-10 mph.

Other times it never happens while driving for the day.

What causes that? I read the hub has nothing to do with what range the truck is in, it would be the motor on the transfer case, but could it be a damaged hub? Bad electrical signal?

miesk5
11-12-2010, 09:03 AM
yo,
Take time to read thru this;
Four Wheel Drive (4X4) General Information, Operation & Troubleshooting TSB 92-1-8 Bronco, F Series & Ranger (COMPLETE); Includes Electric Shift On The Fly (ESOF) Troubleshooting; Source: by Ford via Chilton (http://content.chiltonsonline.com/TSB/displayTSBHandler.ashx?assetID=36059&key=6kAUBD5BruOJf%2f3tgozUqjXM3RdbjcQqW4sVWiE%2fp2 IojfpfKqM07dr61%2bQAWHtTZr4ceHaQGlj8NylACcNZ4qedMq y4JdYyAXN5akgfkpHUz4aCpJyaaA%3d%3d)

Troubleshooting begins on page 8

Indicator Light info begins on page 10


Indicator Lights Don't Register the Correct Information

Ranger, Bronco II and Explorer have indicator lights in two locations. There are lights on the dash and LED indicator lights in the switches. Other vehicles have only the dash lights. If the dash lights on any vehicle don't respond, look for no power or a burned out bulb.

If the lights are on all the time, look for a short to ground. Also check to see if the shift control module is activating them all...this is a malfunction.

If the LED lights, in the buttons, remain on all the time, first check to see if the dash lights are also on. If the dash lights are not on, this means that the dash lights have burned out. The LED lights are on because a low current is still passing across, enough to light the LED.

If no lights illuminate as you go through the shifts and ground power and bulbs are good, then the module is at fault or the motor has stopped at an intermediate point.

theramsey3
11-12-2010, 06:11 PM
miesk5 I just thought I would let you know I have a 95 F150 with ESOF I have lights on the switch and on the dash they both illuminate when the 4X4 is engaged. But what are they talking about with "Ranger, Bronco II and Explorer have indicator lights in two locations. There are lights on the dash and LED indicator lights in the switches. Other vehicles have only the dash lights. If the dash lights on any vehicle don't respond, look for no power or a burned out bulb." Does my truck have a set of switches that should have been in one of those vehicles? Or did chiltons just have an OOPS?

miesk5
11-13-2010, 03:41 AM
yo Ramsey,

That TSB is by Ford; Chilton just posts it in their on-line site via Local Library
But it may have some confusing info, based on year, and model changes; such as what you may have. They just didn't get drilled down enuf to specify the switches, etc by speficic model.
This is from my 96 Owner Guide;
Touch Drive system indicator lights

A 4x4 indicator light and a LOW RANGE indicator light are located at the lower right of the instrument cluster. In addition, two small amber lights are located near the Touch Drive system buttons. The amber light to the left of the 4x4 button will light up at the same time as the 4x4 instrument panel light. The amber light to the left of the LOW RANGE light will light up at the same time as the instrument panel LOW RANGE light. "

m1e1w1
11-19-2010, 12:41 PM
Thanks for that TSB, its got a lot of tips. Question on the information, the TSB mentioned a "motor position sensor indicates the position of the shift motor shaft. The shift control module needs to know where the shaft is before making a new shift. When this sensor isn’t functioning properly or the motor stops slightly off location, the shift control module may become confused". Where is the sensor located? Also, still have the knock at low speeds on the left hub. I pulled it out and nothing is cracked or lose. the axle has about 1/16th play in / out, but tight up and down, side to side.
The dash light iluminates 4x4 low range intermitintly when driving, the knock isent there when i start cold. after the truck is warmed up it starts knocking, so im thinking heat from the axle or bearings is causing a component to shift.
when in nutral, Drive, 2, or 1 i can hit the 4x4 high and 4x4 low, and the transfer case motor clicks to enguage it.
Ill check and lift the truck to see if it enguages the front shaft while i check everything else.

miesk5
11-21-2010, 12:06 PM
yo
I was away, sorry;
Motor position sensor sensor plugs into Xfer case and wiring is connected to shift motor harness;
http://www.therangerstation.com/tech_library/images/TCaseshiftmotor1.JPG

1356 Electric Motor position sensor & Shift Speed Sensor Location in a 91 Explorer, but Similar; Miesk5 Note Ford Part Number is 7f293 speed sensor (http://www.cobraxp.com/Files/xfer%20case.pdf)Source: by Ford via cobraxp.com

RickyB
11-21-2010, 10:27 PM
Just get one of these and call it a day. Trust me, it's not worth screwing around with the SOTF crap , as it's an archaic, overly complicated and troublesome P.O.S. system that will eventually leave you stranded one day-----far, far from home...........


http://theshiftster.com/

theramsey3
11-22-2010, 06:49 AM
mine wasn't that hard or expensive to fix. used the multi meter to diagnose then changed the transfer case motor and kept the original speed sensor took like 30 minutes to diagnose and change the part.

1980ranger
11-22-2010, 02:14 PM
That would suck to have to get out of your truck every time i need to engage the transfercase.

RickyB
11-22-2010, 04:54 PM
That would suck to have to get out of your truck every time i need to engage the transfercase.


Sorry you feel different so strongly about that. Hope that none of my 100+ satisfied customers (including several females) don't read your post---then the cat will be out of the bag and they'll come-a-gunnin' for me.........:toothless


(btw, don't you get out of your truck anyways, to lock your hubs? :thumbup )

AZDesertDogg91
11-28-2010, 03:46 PM
As long as you keep a socket, wrench, on board - you won't ever get stranded. 3 bolts and the motor is off for a manual turn without that shiftster. Tons of auto hub haters on this forum. Still rockin mine after 190,000k.

RickyB
11-28-2010, 04:02 PM
As long as you keep a socket, wrench, on board - you won't ever get stranded. 3 bolts and the motor is off for a manual turn without that shiftster. Tons of auto hub haters on this forum. Still rockin mine after 190,000k.

A manual turn to where? Cuz that shaft sure as hell won't stay in 4 High by itself. Trust me, I've been working on this thing for almost 2 years now........

RickyB
11-28-2010, 04:16 PM
And just out of curiosity, out of those 190k miles, how many would you say were driven with your 'Rockin' auto hubs actually engaged? Fifteen? Twenty seven? Forty one?

More?..........

AZDesertDogg91
11-28-2010, 08:08 PM
And just out of curiosity, out of those 190k miles, how many would you say were driven with your 'Rockin' auto hubs actually engaged? Fifteen? Twenty seven? Forty one?

More?..........

Lol... About as many as you chief.

A manual turn to where?

That's even funnier. The guy that offers a manual turn device for sale is asking where to manually turn it.

RickyB
11-28-2010, 08:23 PM
Lol... About as many as you chief.

A manual turn to where?

That's even funnier. The guy that offers a manual turn device for sale is asking where to manually turn it.



1). And you know that how?

2). If you would have read not only your post, but mine, you'd understand.

3). See #2.

4). Honey, you're way the hell out of your league here, so I suggest you get back home before Mom kicks your ass for being late for dinner.

5). And finally, I can't take anyone seriously that has a real 4x4, but still uses auto hubs. Complete phayle on your part Dear. G'nite............

AZDesertDogg91
11-28-2010, 11:11 PM
You and your 4,000 posts are certified jerk wad. You've actually pushed your garbage on that many poor souls - sad. Your use of grammar is K-6 at best. How was another Thanksgiving spent alone? What an internet hot head...
It's been a bit of comic relief knowing how flamed up you've gotten over nothing. Let me know how the unemplyment line is treating you tomorrow morning.

Redondo Beach... Do you lock those hubs in for the beach? Give me a break. I'm not going to compare made up trail stories with you (I know you will) but I'm on my 3rd FSB. I'm still driving my latest at 190k strong. I've wheeled in some of the most rock infested desert that the world has to offer. Just finished a great run this weekend. I'm not pretending to be a rock crawler in my FSB (had a TJ for that). I've put my time in behind the wheel of my rig on and off road.

People like you are desperate gools that thrive on your self perceived notion of superiority on a web-site. You Sir are a genuine prick!

Go be angry at the world somewhere else and return this thread to it's topic.

broncoflorida
11-28-2010, 11:47 PM
The shifter ideal is not that bad if you had a way to cable it up into the cab.

On the argument of getting out to turn the manual hubs, well I would lock my hubs before attempting any off road driving that could lead to me getting stuck. It would suck to have to get into water/mud just to turn the hubs to "engage" on a set of warn or milemarkers and it would suck even more having to get underneath the FSB to turn a shifter :cry when standing in 2ft of water.

RickyB
11-29-2010, 09:32 AM
You and your 4,000 posts are certified jerk wad. You've actually pushed your garbage on that many poor souls - sad. Your use of grammar is K-6 at best. How was another Thanksgiving spent alone? What an internet hot head...
It's been a bit of comic relief knowing how flamed up you've gotten over nothing. Let me know how the unemplyment line is treating you tomorrow morning.

Redondo Beach... Do you lock those hubs in for the beach? Give me a break. I'm not going to compare made up trail stories with you (I know you will) but I'm on my 3rd FSB. I'm still driving my latest at 190k strong. I've wheeled in some of the most rock infested desert that the world has to offer. Just finished a great run this weekend. I'm not pretending to be a rock crawler in my FSB (had a TJ for that). I've put my time in behind the wheel of my rig on and off road.

People like you are desperate gools that thrive on your self perceived notion of superiority on a web-site. You Sir are a genuine prick!

Go be angry at the world somewhere else and return this thread to it's topic.



1). Get back to me after you finally do a trip that's a bit more difficult than driving thru the mall parking lot at Scottsdale. You know, like the one I did to northern Panama in an FJ55 back in 1980? Then we can talk.

2). Oh yes Darling, I am a prick. But a very wise one who's been around the block more than once. So it would behoove yourself to sit back and listen carefully when us grown-ups are speaking.

3). And if I really wanted to argue with a g-damn tool all night, I'd rather go out to my shop and discuss Liberal politics or religion with my drill press.........:toothless

RickyB
11-29-2010, 09:40 AM
On the argument of getting out to turn the manual hubs, well I would lock my hubs before attempting any off road driving that could lead to me getting stuck. It would suck to have to get into water/mud just to turn the hubs to "engage" on a set of warn or milemarkers and it would suck even more having to get underneath the FSB to turn a shifter :cry when standing in 2ft of water.


Oh yeah, I agree completely. So it kinda helps to plan accordingly and lock your t-case before you're underwater...........:toothless

DrDuktayp
11-29-2010, 11:01 PM
m1e1w1 I would suggest that you think about what condition your rig is in and how you are going to use it. Each of us use our vehicles differently and like them to be unique to us. Paint color, music or not, CB radios, air compressors, lights and light bars.... the list goes on and on. You decide what you want with your rig.

My first Bronco was the newer model with the push button t-case. It was my DD and at the time four-wheeling for me was getting to work when it was snowing or taking the kids up to snowboard. I believe it was a 94 and it was the XLT package with electric leather seats. If something would have happened to the push button I would have fixed it. It was a beautiful SUV.

My current bronco (82) is locked front and rear. When it is cold out I keep the hubs locked and just put it into 4H when the road is icey or snowy. I am glad that I can reach down and pop it into 4wd with out crawling underneath however, I would not want anything electric on this rig. I am working toward KISS principle.

The Shifterser looks like a trouble free solution and I have seen many vehicles where the electrical system is a disaster and it would be an inexpensive fix.