well, the bronco is due to get the D60 put in soon. probably mid to end next week it is goign up on stands, the 44's getting ripped out of the front.
i just ordered the weld on tabs from james duff, as bronco graveyard wanted way to much $$ for rusty used ones still attached to an axle. ya, i could have cut my d44 up, but somebody else could use it....
just use one of my HP44's to mock up and set everything off of? ill check my cyrrent caster as it sits and maybe adjust acordingly?
i gots a date with the torch and grinder with that dana 60 i guess to get all the extra junk off of it.

should be a bolt in basically other than welding on the tabs and the trac bar spot. I figure it will be down for 2 weeks, sometimes in peices, but mostly sitting waiting for the parts for the front axle, as im not even gonna pu tit back toghther before i gear and lock it.
someone buy my d44 parts! i need money for locker $550 and gears $250!
i figure the only mods are gonna be my front driveshaft slightly changing, but my front D lines shot anyway, so it doesnt matter. i guess im also just going to leave the front shaft out when it sits in its corner till i regear the rear axle lower.

any hints on welding the tabs on the axle(specifically driver side) on my 87 D60 kingpin?
thanks
Zach

Glad to see you are back in the game...good luck with it and be sure to let us know how it is going.:thumbup

any hints on welding the tabs on the axle(specifically driver side) on my 87 D60 kingpin? I'd get some plate and start making some mounts for links. :shrug

For the C's you have to decide if your going to mill out the centers to fit the 60, or just make a spacer.
Then allign the caster with a good angle meter

From what I hear, the correct way would be to use a jig i/o to get the angles right. You have to decide on what link system you plan on using...4 link, radius arm, etc... It will be very hard to fit the C-wedges on the drivers side axle because there's barely any axle tube to weld it to. From what I learned, the 78/9 had more tube and it's easier to weld the C wedges. I have the same axle, but plan on going with the leaf spring setup. It's just cheaper and easier to do. Check out Rob Ellis' homepage on superford. His coilover setup is sweet, but he took apart the Bronc' and now he's transforming it into a "rock buggy/Bronc hybrid." I don't know if his pics got demolished after the last superford crash...:shrug

Originally posted by J-Roc
From what I hear, the correct way would be to use a jig i/o to get the angles right. You have to decide on what link system you plan on using...4 link, radius arm, etc... It will be very hard to fit the C-wedges on the drivers side axle because there's barely any axle tube to weld it to. From what I learned, the 78/9 had more tube and it's easier to weld the C wedges. I have the same axle, but plan on going with the leaf spring setup. It's just cheaper and easier to do. Check out Rob Ellis' homepage on superford. His coilover setup is sweet, but he took apart the Bronc' and now he's transforming it into a "rock buggy/Bronc hybrid." I don't know if his pics got demolished after the last superford crash...:shrug

Why do people always think that leafs are cheaper and easier? I hear that crap all the time! I replaced my D44 with a D60 in one day and all it cost me was the 70 bucks for the C's. A couple quick measurements for the angle and weld them on. I have a newer 60 so the driverrs side was smaller, but they still went on pretty easy. Nothing a grinder cant take care of. You can use the same coils you had before, TTB or Solid it dont matter. If you have the skill to do a SAS you can make either coil fit.

Dont get me wrong I have seem a few pretty set up leaf spring swaps, but either way it will end up costing you about the same both ways.

im just gonna use y current rad arm setup. i have way to many other projects to spend time and $$ on. just getting th e60 locked and geared is gonna cost enough....
all i have to do is clean the axle up, weld on the C mounts, and weld on a trac bar mount, and presto, it bolts on! no screwing around and redesigning. i can always go back and change it later and do a 4 link, as this setup is only gonna cost me about $70 in the C wedges to install.........

pics

http://www.fourdoorbronco.com/images/pismo03/DSCF1488.JPG

http://www.fourdoorbronco.com/images/pismo03/DSCF1487.JPG

http://www.fourdoorbronco.com/images/pismo03/DSCF1490.JPG

Originally posted by dblue351
Why do people always think that leafs are cheaper and easier? I hear that crap all the time! I replaced my D44 with a D60 in one day and all it cost me was the 70 bucks for the C's. A couple quick measurements for the angle and weld them on. I have a newer 60 so the driverrs side was smaller, but they still went on pretty easy. Nothing a grinder cant take care of. You can use the same coils you had before, TTB or Solid it dont matter. If you have the skill to do a SAS you can make either coil fit.

Dont get me wrong I have seem a few pretty set up leaf spring swaps, but either way it will end up costing you about the same both ways.

But Dave didnt you just break your radius arm and a bunch of other crap?
That my friend is gonna be a PITA to fix and bucks.

If you had leafs holding that 60 do you think that would have happened?
and if it did, it probably would have just broke at the u bolts and new u-bolts are cheap. then if the axle moved to much you might have broke the front yoke or u-joint, still a quick and cheap easy fix. Your only prob would be alignment till you got back to the shop.

I am not trying to talk shiz, or judge you or anything, your rig is a hell of a lot more capable than mine, but I am just trying to make a statement for friendly arguements sake.. Hope you know what I mean.

IMO if and when I swap i wanna use leafs because IMO they are easier, and more stable. Most 60's come with leaf mounts anyway, you dont have to fab up radius arm mounts or buy radius arms.
Plus NO TRACK BAR.
They leafs dont flex as well as coils (of course), but i dont really need flex I need stability.

For my style though i am probably just gonna stick with a 76 d44 and weld the leafs mounts on.

damm, im definatly just bolting this thing on, considering my price list to get the axle to where i want it is gonna cost me $1040, or maybe another $100 if the one outer shaft is trashed....

why do you keep bring up the trac bar issue? its really not that hard to build or have someone build it if needed

Well Dustin so far my research is all mental. i have not had the hands on work yet.
I have read thousands of sas write ups on several boards, and even from experienced fabers and welders it seems that a lot of people have had problems building, using, or maintaining a track bar.
So someone at one time just said the simple advise of not using one.
People argued and flamed on stating that without a track bar his axle would not align right, or the stability would not be as strong, etc.
Well this person did it , and runs his rig at comp level, and does not have any issues. Doesnt have to worry about coils sagging or breaking, or bending a track bar, or having to deal with the custom mounts, and end links.
It is a lot of cost for GOOD quality track bar stuff as you know, since you are running the good stuff (IIRC)
So we have a friendly disagreement, no big deal, that what friends do right?
I have my opinions and you have yours.
With my options, and limited resources, i feel more comfortable using leafs and only having to do the minimal welding and custom work, rather than the other routes.
I know coils will ride better than springs but again thats something I still prefer.

Another thing is sometimes, I have a heavy foot. i have broke coils (Ask petti bone, or Mr. Flat tire or what ever he goes by now) i got to buy my replacements from him (Thanks again Tom).
I dont see myself breaking leaf springs ever.

It is also a lot more cost savvy to carry spare u-bolts and hangers rather than spare track bars, and spare extended radius arms, or spare rod ends.
i dont need to go into the cost factor there because it is obvious.

Where is keith_L on this?
It kinda pisses me off that he seems to always be there when he needs to flame me, but when I am trying to make a valid point on a set up that (btw which he is running) he is never here to back my arse up. :goodfinge

So Dustin, i have said it before your rig is awesome, amazing, etc. I have talked to Scott and told him that IMHO his sas is the cleanest I have ever seen. (Which of course is just like yours)
If i had that resource i would go that route, but dont now do i?

So it is not my opinion that my set up plans will be any better or worse than yours it is just a matter of cost, availability, resouces, and my personal opinion.

So I hope this helps why i keep trying to bring that up.

It is also a lot more savvy to carry spare u-bolts rather than spare track bars, and spare extended radius arms.
your hangars are gonna bust off before you break 9/16ths or 5/8ths U bolts. your custom hangars are gonna give, then you would be ****ed on the trail, but that most likely wont happen.

stop whinning.

Damn it I didnt submit my edit before you posted.
Oh well I added hangers.

I am not whinning either pus sy fart, i am still amazed that you are finally driving your "FULL SIZE" truck now and trying to offer my advise.
It is not like what i am saying doesnt make any sense.

So just like everyone else has said G.F.Y.

Originally posted by BadassBronco
[but that most likely wont happen.

You were saying?

i think you mean carrying spare shackles... try getting the wording right!
you are finally driving your "FULL SIZE" truck now
I am? last i saw of it was still sitting in the same spot since it was onloaded off the trailer in my avitar pic.
i said i was gonna work on it, i didnt say shit about driving it......

also, do yourself a favor and click on my sig!

Nope, i dont wanna click on it because I dont want to see any of your charlie ass banger pics
:goodfinge :goodfinge :goodfinge

i guess I meant shackles. So your right.

I dont hate you, just wanted to bust your balls a bit, like you busted mine thats all.
:goodfinge :goodfinge :goodfinge


Oh and Do please drive the rig, it is to coo to leave it sittin.

its nothng bad, just click on it!
zilla made it!
Nope, i dont wanna click on it because I dont want to see any of your charlie ass banger pics

funny I clicked it to see what happens. Where'd you go :goodfinge

Focker i clicked it too.:goodfinge

Originally posted by NOBS!
you're a little late. i don't see them having a real problem. I guess you just had to get that off your irritated breasts?
ya, we where joking around.
nobs, is there anythign wrong with my sig line? its funny!

funny to me. but then again i enjoy stuff that pisses people off.

hahahaha

Ok somewhere in this mess i saw a refference to my acident! Yes all of this would have happened with the leafs too. Only If i had leafs I dont think I would have been able to get out at all.


The main reason I broke was do to the weight of my shit and teh extreme angle I came down at. I for sure would have bent a leaf pac. But then again it might not have happened because if i had leafs I would not have the flex I needed to go in there in teh first place!

Yes the radius arms bent, I just need to weld so steel in them for more support. My track bar was fine, but the frame failed. Again just need more support.

Has anyone else noticed how a lot of new trucks wih leaf front ends have track bars too. They are more necessary then people think. Just doing a leaf sprung front end is not going to slove all your porblems. Also the thing about breaking coils???? I have seen and heard of people breaking WAYYYYY more leaf packs then coils! Actually you are the first person I have ever heard of breaking a coil!

My main thing is if you do not have the skills or resourses to do a swap then dont do it. Coil or leaf. Just stay with the TTB. TTB is just fine for normal 4 wheeling.

EASY IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER.



To each his own! If you want to do leafs do it. If you want coils do it. I am tired of people asking which is better and what should I do when they have their minds made up already!

Originally posted by Beerman
I am not trying to talk shiz, or judge you or anything, your rig is a hell of a lot more capable than mine, but I am just trying to make a statement for friendly arguements sake.. Hope you know what I mean.

Like I said "friendly" Dave.
I wasnt talking sh!t, it was a question.

Why are you coming off as some kind of an a-sshole?

I obviously wasnt there to witness your little "accident" so if I dont ask a "question" then I wouldnt know, now would I????

I mean, the only pic my POS pc at work would allow me to see is the one with your radius arm all bent out of place.
But it sounds to me that you got in a pretty hairy situation, and if the frame failed then it failed, you have a defence. But when someone asks you a f@cking question about it, you dont need to tell someone that they dont have skills to do a SAS, or however you meant to come across.

Just doing a leaf sprung front end is not going to slove all your porblems.

DUH, But do you think it might just be a little better than my stock TTB set up? Maybe just a little ennie weenie bit?

My main thing is if you do not have the skills to do a swap then dont do it. Coil or leaf.
I thought we got on here to share information, and learn, and we are human and will have constructive critisizm.
Like I said before , I didnt mean any disrespect, but you obviously got upset over something.
It is your rig, and it is your mess. i just hope that some day when you need help someone will tell you they are sick of people asking them questions, and just bit ch at you for it. Then maybe you will know what it feels like.

SO if I hurt your feel bads then I am truly sorry, but jesus christ have some back bone man.

it's all constructive......just alittle heated is all. :thumbup

Originally posted by NOBS!
it's all constructive......just alittle heated is all. :thumbup

I know I can always count on you queef breath :goodfinge :goodfinge :beer :toothless

Oh and Dave do you know a guy who once said this?

Coils = track bar(which sucks!) leafs = no track bar.

HHHHHMMMMMMM

SO which one of your "views" is current, the one you stated on your forum on Fri Aug 15, 2003 11:16 am or the one you posted today?

Just curious.

I dont see how Daves response insulted you.

I think your just reading all of it in CAPS.:beer

Originally posted by Beerman
Oh and Dave do you know a guy who once said this?

Coils = track bar(which sucks!) leafs = no track bar.

HHHHHMMMMMMM

SO which one of your "views" is current, the one you stated on your forum on Fri Aug 15, 2003 11:16 am or the one you posted today?

Just curious.

OMG!!

Calm down Matlock!!!:lolup

Do you want some advise or not?

:goodfinge :goodfinge :lolup :lolup

Originally posted by BrianH
I dont see how Daves response insulted you.

I think your just reading all of it in CAPS.:beer

I am pretty sure he was reffering to me when he said

My main thing is if you do not have the skills or resourses to do a swap then dont do it. Coil or leaf. Just stay with the TTB. TTB is just fine for normal 4 wheeling.

EASY IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER.

The way I took it was as if, I am not the same caliper of a driver that he is. Kinda the ol saying "If you cant keep up, then stay the f at home".

and the whole "Normal" wheeling comment.

As if I am a curb stomper.

It also sounds as if he doesnt believe my story about breaking a coil. Like I would really be that hard up to replace a perfectly good coil with a stock replacement that I had to buy and pay shipping on from Tom in Cali.
Tom gave me an excellent price and was WAY cool about it too.

OK< SO if I can read the future right then he will probably come back with :Wheres the pic:?

and then I am going to say "Do you really think I would take a picture of a broken coil and post it"?
If I would have then I really would have been hurting for attention.

All in all, if I am being a turd then I will quit, but I talk on the god damn internet all day and I can pick up sarcasm as well as anyone else.

I never stepped on Daves toes ever!!!!!
I always complimented him on his rig, his mods, and thanked him for his help.
If he doesnt beleive me then he can try to prove me wrong.
If someone takes teh time out of their day to help me then I always thank them.
Like today for example, 2bit (aka NOBS) posted a simple link to help me understand a wierd steering set up.
I thanked him several times, IMHO it makes people feel like their time is appreciated.
Now if I called him a cocksucker or told him that he shouldnt do this or that because he is a normal wheeler, or doesnt have the skills then he probably would not be to incline to assist me in teh future.
(BTW, I am on a caffiene rush if you couldnt tell).

ok I cleaned some of the crap posts out of this thread to try and keep it on track.

I have said this before and will again, there are several ways to do an sas and I think everyone has done theirs a little differently given there situation, yours is no exception. It seems like everyone lately is doing the swap, which is cool and all but the whole feeling of "custom" is going away. I guess I need to drop a D60, some coilovers and link the front to be cool.

just trying to get an idea why you where so anti trac bar. They do take a little thinking to get right but like you know I havent had any problems with mine so far. I dont remember how much cash I have in mine but I dont think its an obsene amount, but if your on a tight budget every bit of cash helps i guess.

I with dave on the coil, Ive never seen or heard of anyone busting a coil. Im by no means doubting that you did break but Ive seen more leafs break out there than coils.

Damn fool! You took all that WAY to personal. It was more of a in general staying! If you think all that was pointed at you then thats your problem.

I stand by my statement that if you dont have the skills to do a swap then you should not do it. It is not something you just jump into. That went to everyone, not just you. For me the swap was easy. Cut here weld there. No big deal, and Mark helped me a ton.

This was never an attack at you, I think Badass got you too wired up and now you are reading into things more than you should.



Now I am off to go kick babies and shoot puppies! :goodfinge

Originally posted by dblue351

Now I am off to go kick babies and shoot puppies! :goodfinge

what did those puppies ever do to you?!!!!

Dustin I hope you know that I never intended any of this at you.

TTYTT it does confuse me a bit, and the work looks a little difficult.

but even if I do have to use or make or have made a track bar then I will still use leafs.

IMHO i feel that it will make me the individual and meet my off roading needs. (I am not using a D60 either).

I think it is getting more and more popular because as more and more people do them , then people have more resources to fall on.

I didnt even fathom the idea until Raf decided to do it early last year. so I have had less than one year to learn about this shiz.

I also feel as if the TTB people cant confide in their fellow member anymore unless your sole intention is to do the swap.

I read posts everyday on how some guy said "Today I changed my front shocks", and someone will come back with "WHy in the helll did you not do a SAS when you had the chance, when are you going to realize that the ttb set up is a POS and you are simply stupid for thinking you can off road in it, you should die a long horrible death you ttb riding SOB".

That is the way i perceive it.

So yes what I am saying is that even oc FSB there is politics.

Another thing is this.
If one super popular guy does this, then the next cool guy has to do that, then followed up by the next super cool guy, etc.

I am sick and tired of the pissing contest. already.

Originally posted by Bronkzilla
what did those puppies ever do to you?!!!!

One gave me the evil eye!

i f one super popular guy does this, then the next cool guy has to do that, then followed up by the next super cool guy, etc.
.
hey, im only doing mine cause i got it cheap!

Originally posted by dblue351
Damn fool! You took all that WAY to personal. It was more of a in general staying! If you think all that was pointed at you then thats your problem.

I stand by my statement that if you dont have the skills to do a swap then you should not do it. It is not something you just jump into. That went to everyone, not just you. For me the swap was easy. Cut here weld there. No big deal, and Mark helped me a ton.

This was never an attack at you, I think Badass got you too wired up and now you are reading into things more than you should.



Now I am off to go kick babies and shoot puppies! :goodfinge

Then do what I did next time and say something like:
"Beerman this is not a stab at you, or an insult."

You know kinda like what I said when I asked you that one question.

Oh well, you kick the puppies, and I will kick the babies. :goodfinge

If you are being cool about it then like I said before I am truly sorry, you see I am a man that can admit when I am wrong. I just wish others had those minerals too.
I still respect you and your rig, even if it farcking floats over rocks with jet fuel powered engines and wheel bearings.

Originally posted by Beerman
Dustin I hope you know that I never intended any of this at you.



I never took it that way either.

:beer

Originally posted by Beerman
The way I took it was as if, I am not the same caliper of a driver that he is. Kinda the ol saying "If you cant keep up, then stay the f at home".

and the whole "Normal" wheeling comment.
hell, i wheel with him. i'm stock. i've had to sit a few out, but it doesn't seem to bother him that i'm one of those still stock TTB fags.

one day i will have Unimog axles and i will be cooler than all of you:goodfinge

LOL, nice andy.


Sorry to say Andy but I have no more rear seat, so you better get the shit built! :goodfinge

i've got some mog axles in my backyard.....:goodfinge

Beerman.....you do your share of flaming,admit it. the problem is you can't choose when and where it comes back to you. nothing you can do about it. getting pissed and jumping on your high horse isn't gonna help. you never see me get pissed do ya :angel hehe I get picked all the time :cry

:goodfinge

your right bud, last night I got a little drunk and I think i let my emotions go crazy. Reading what I wrote last night this morning I am kinda thinking I sound like a little b!tch.:duh

:cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry :cry

You guys warm my icey heart

leafs + axle wrap....

Originally posted by jopes
leafs + axle wrap....
yes, and axle wrap breaks shit!

Unless I get the Solid for free I am staying with the ttb guess I will have to be one of THOSE fags as well.

this article is damm amusing! its just one big cat fight! heh, by the way, i agree with coils, has anybody ever watch a K5 Blazer flex?? heh my stock bronc w/o swaybar flexed tons more! I guess if you invest in softride springs it would work well. I just like coils beter if nothing else!

Originally posted by dblue351
I have no more rear seat, so you better get the shit built! :goodfinge

:( :cry :(

still lookign for a pic of this mounte done on the driveside and what the housing looked like when it was done.....
on a 86+ D60

I did not read the whole thread, as I am uninterested in pissing contests, but if you are talking about the radius arm wedges, I am in the slow process of doing this myself. will have pics some time in the near future, of course i am sure you are not wanting to wait zach, so i guess, nevermind.

that was a waste of time. :shrug

wow, I just went back and read some of this and I will say this.

beerman, you seriously need to step away from the compuer and relax. You stated it sounds like you were whining, and your right. From a different perspective, we have that done SAS, and not just read about them, have the time in and know from experience what all is involved. Everything seems easy when you read about what someone else has done and can look at their pictures. rather than debate the leaf/coil thing constantly, spend your time collecting what you need to do your swap and do it. THEN, you can tell us all how the swap went. But stop telling us what someone told you , or what you read somewhere. Dave is a friend of mine, an agressive and experinced wheeler, and someone who (like me and the others who have done an SAS) spends a lot of time UNDER their rigs and tries things. For you to get into a pissing contest, waste the time to go back and research what he said when and where is absurd. You dont have to have the final word in here. Like you said, all you have done is spent the last year learning about this stuff. there are two people that have done leaf swaps that i know of. both worked very well. that is great for them and us cause it gives us options, but there work is no better than anyone elses. So let it go. Please.


Oh and just for clarification, this is directed at you Beerman, not anyone else.


Stepping of my soapbox and expecting that beerman, you WILL have the final word.

Originally posted by plug ugly
I did not read the whole thread, as I am uninterested in pissing contests, but if you are talking about the radius arm wedges, I am in the slow process of doing this myself. will have pics some time in the near future, of course i am sure you are not wanting to wait zach, so i guess, nevermind.

that was a waste of time. :shrug
ya, i intend on doing this soon.
all the crap is stripped off my axle and i am in the masuring and acting stage.
now the questioon is how do i make this work?

put the whole wedge on the cast part?
grind down the wedges to make it fit on the acual tube part?
make a spacer to bring the outside tube diameter up to the casting dimameter grind the wedges out, then weld on?
technically to keep it the same measurement as on the D44 it need sto be all the way towards the steering knuckle as far as it will go
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=83997&toggle=fullsize&filename=driversidetabissue.jpg

there are two ways i know of that you can use. First, just weld the brackets on and then use an appro 1 " spacer between the rad arm and cups (daves method). the other way is grinding the wedges down to fit the 4 inch tube. On the di side, you will have to grind/cut down the spring pad so it is round, then grind down the inside part of the wedge more where it will sit against the casting part of the diff.(bills method) I am in the process of doing this myself. Have most of the pad off and am now working on the shitty swaybar bracket. I dont know how they welded that fawker in there unless they did it first, and then pressed in the tubes.:mad:
Clear as mud?

Originally posted by plug ugly
Have most of the pad off and am now working on the shitty swaybar bracket. I dont know how they welded

ya, i torched, then grinded some to finish it up this afternoon
that bracket was a PITA do to the tightness to fit in the grinder

cool, thanks for the info on the driverside. i think im gonna do what bill did and grind just that one part of the tab to fit the housing.

cool. I have no torch, so I have been thru 3 sawzall blades (they keep warping from the heat) and a cut off disc for the grinder. I am still no where near being done. It is tight there.

well i will say a torch helped. i have a 79 D60 so i have a ton of room. i am grinding the <> so i dont have to use spacers between the radius arms & caps. its been raining for 16 hours now and my top is off. it can only get so wet right? still a nice weekend. i am going to find some mud in the morning and have a little fun. i gotta build a jig first. my stuff should be on soon i hope. i got lucky and the <> had a little extra. the trac bar mount is cast into the <>'s and this should look like a stock install if all goes right. AXE

do you find the cast anlge inrelation to the pinion angle is off some. i am findingthat it is a few degress lower than the 79 d44.
i really dont want to end up cutting and turning thr knuckles if i dont have to....
seems like the pinion angle is going to be crappy if i set it up just like the d44.

Originally posted by plug ugly
wow, I just went back and read some of this and I will say this.

Oh and just for clarification, this is directed at you Beerman, not anyone else.

Stepping of my soapbox and expecting that beerman, you WILL have the final word.


Ok just a couple of things.
1) I mentioned that i was drunk durring the pissing match and that i resolved things with Dave.

2) Again I did feel that he was directing insults my way. Again i was wrong and admitted to it.

3) I dont like feeling like some guy who doesnt know anything because I dont have the money to do what I CAN do.

4) and just to dispel everyones beliefs about leafs not flexing well I hope this pic will help with that:
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=80446&toggle=fullsize&filename=ramp3.jpg
A 1025 seems do be a pretty damn good score to me.
I would like to see the guys with 6" coils and 35's do this.........
( I will eat my words pending pictures, data).

Courtesy of Keith Lawlers SF page.
Thank you.

I never flat out said that one was better than the other, I just said that for my needs, blah blah blah, and then backed them up with solid data.

In a scientists point of view I dont have to have AIDS to know what the side effects are, so actually "doing" the swap and having all my appropriate data does not make you a better person, or a smarter person, just because you have done it. Neither does it make I.

Hopefully one day I will do the swap, AND, hopefully since I took the time and gathered all the appropriate data I WONT have to go back and fix everything like MANY people have.
I was brought up to do things right the first time, and HOPEFULLY with my research, I may be succesfull.

(That comment is by no means targeted at any one person or member).

So agaijn i am NOT starting a pissing match.
I think that I just have the balls that many people dont when it comes to disagree with a serious off roader like Dave, Jopes, Keith, Etc.
I dont ever want to come across as disrespectful. I dont take anything away from these guys, they have helped me a TON whether they think so or not. They are the ones that many people look up to, and they have teh proof in teh pudding.

So all in all, I want there to be peace on this forum, and I just hope we can all get along. :beer

Originally posted by Beerman

So all in all, I want there to be peace on this forum, and I just hope we can all get along. :beer


hahahaha :lolup hahahaha coming from YOU Bro that's funny :histerica



:wacko :chili:

How did I know you would be the first to comment...:goodfinge :toothless

I would like to see the guys with 6" coils and 35's do this......... no problem.

Originally posted by NOBS!
no problem.

Really?
If you have pics that would be awesome.

Then I will finally shut my mouth (SIKE) :toothless :toothless

i had it on SF. I'll dig the stills out one day and do some re-scanning. 1176 on the 20*

In a scrotum lickers point of view I dont have to have AIDS to know what the side effects are, so actually "doing" the swap and having all my appropriate tendancies does not make you better at playing hoopsnake , just because I have done it,doesn't mean you have too as well.

interesting analogy :goodfinge

Flex isnt always what its all about on the trail though....
ya, im kinda condridicting myself with this as im doing that long travel air suspension, but i am doing that to try something different, and fairly new to the broncos. im interested in doing different crap as you guys can tell.

Originally posted by plug ugly
cool. I have no torch, so I have been thru 3 sawzall blades (they keep warping from the heat) and a cut off disc for the grinder. I am still no where near being done. It is tight there.

doing the same thing right now. It is a serious pain. Off to the store for more cutoff discs.

here you go, 6" coils and 35's. Actually they are 8" fabtech, 2wd coils, but they measure the same height as a 6" 4wd coil. Now I understand this is not on a ramp, and you cant see the rear flex(which is where most of all of our flex comes from, whether front leaves or coils) but i think this flexes pretty well. The only small prob I have had was with my radius arm brackets needing some reinforcement, but simialr probs could be had with leaf hangars and shackles.
So I fell justified.

http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=72840&toggle=fullsize&f=dflex.jpg

is that with the wristed arm Damon?

damn, that ramp has some sweeeet looking fab work! :beer

Damn Keith, you'z puttin a hurtin on those shackles! :goodfinge

Originally posted by NOBS!
interesting analogy :goodfinge


:lolup :goodfinge :brownbag

Originally posted by plug ugly
here you go, 6" coils and 35's. Actually they are 8" fabtech, 2wd coils, but they measure the same height as a 6" 4wd coil. Now I understand this is not on a ramp, and you cant see the rear flex(which is where most of all of our flex comes from, whether front leaves or coils) but i think this flexes pretty well. The only small prob I have had was with my radius arm brackets needing some reinforcement, but simialr probs could be had with leaf hangars and shackles.
So I fell justified.

http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=72840&toggle=fullsize&f=dflex.jpg


Yes, i agree your rig is quite capable. it looks really good. i really think those front coils are awesome.

If you are running the front twister or wristed I can definetly see it doing more than a grand rti.

(So again I eat my words).:toothless

Hopefully i will get it done, someday.
All my leads for an axle are falling through.

I am either looking for a 76-77 D44 (coils), or a 77 F250 d44 with leafs. Again i would personally prefer the leafs, but will go coils if that is teh first axle I find.

hey Zach, thats the issue i have been dealing with. castor angle -vs- pinion angle. i guess i will have to get it in there and have a happy medium in between the two and see whats up. i am going to use the jig first and that should get the tabs and the pinion angle all set and from there its wait and see i guess. AXE

hey beerman, why do you want that year axle? i know the tube is thicker, but the shafts & spindles are the same arent they?

you could always cut the Cs loose on the 60 and change the caster angle......

Originally posted by BadassBronco
ya, i intend on doing this soon.
all the crap is stripped off my axle and i am in the masuring and acting stage.
now the questioon is how do i make this work?

put the whole wedge on the cast part?
grind down the wedges to make it fit on the acual tube part?
make a spacer to bring the outside tube diameter up to the casting dimameter grind the wedges out, then weld on?
technically to keep it the same measurement as on the D44 it need sto be all the way towards the steering knuckle as far as it will go
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=83997&toggle=fullsize&filename=driversidetabissue.jpg

Sorry didnt see this post. I have not been in here in a while.

I cut a section out of the C- thing to fit over the hump. Keep in mind that it has a degree to it so try to keep that. Then cut off the spring perch and grind it as round as the center section is. Not down to the tube. Hope this makes sence.

http://www.wt4wheeling.com/dblue351/pics/driverside.jpg

ya,. i had the casting ground down nice and round on top early i nthe week. i have one wedge just about fi tto the casting. all the wedges should be fit and ready to go by the end of the weekend.
im taking my time and not rushing myself since this thing can be down for a long time.
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=84186&toggle=fullsize&filename=drivers side frineded.jpg

Looks like mine did.

thats about where i am too, so i wont post my pics since they look about the same. I think bill, when he did his, mounted everything up before he welded the wedges on, then rotated the axle as needed, spot welded his wedges on, then disassembled everything and finish welded the wedges on. As info

Andy, yes that is with the wristed arm. it made a big difference in flex for me, but we are finding that the rad arms need reinforcing for strength. A possible positive comment for using leaves instead of coils, but i like coils still.

thats what i am going to do. make them fit, mount it and then see what i need to do for angles. i can adjust the castor thats no big deal. its just i wonder where that will point the pinion and if i can get 4* and good pinion angle. only time will tell. i am going to make sure the tip to tip distance of the <O> is the same as on the D44 so i can skip the spacers and not have to redrill the coil retainers... then plate one arm and wrist the other so it can all go in at once. on a weekend. since i drive this bastard everyday. i am looking at a little 4x4 4 banger ranger. funny part is i am already thinking it would look good with my D44 8 lug & D60 after i get a 10.25 and thinking how a 302 would pep it up... AXE

so dave, you did yours liek this. this is your plan isnt it damon?
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=84915&toggle=fullsize&filename=DSC01184.jpg

then both on
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=84922&toggle=fullsize&filename=DSC01191.jpg

i had to remove lots of material.
more pics of the wedges on superford.....
i used grease to check for the interference as i kept oin settign it on the axle. seemed to work great to show me where it was sitting on the high spots.

exactly, but if you do not want to use wedges between the rad arms the two end of the c-cups need to touch each other.

Originally posted by dblue351
exactly, but if you do not want to use wedges between the rad arms the two end of the c-cups need to touch each other.
i am going to use the spacers in the arms.
also, it doesnt have to touch i dont think. i measured them, when the wedges where touching off the axle, and it forms an oval shape. they look like they should have like a 1/4-3/8ths gap on top and bottom....

you might be surprised.

I will forward this post on to bill. I have never sen his off so I dont know how they look exactly. Ill try to get an answer for your zach. i know bill did not use spacers

i am going to use a jig as well as measuring the D44s <O> distance around its points and making the D60 <O> the same. like the band/hose clamp you have on your <O> deals in that pic Zach. if i get it the same i can just skip the spacers. in my application it shouldnt be that hard to do. grinding sucks huh? oh yeah. i think i will get a set of 4* C bushings and fit the axle with them and set the castor at 4* (is that a coincidence?) so if i want to go 2" higher i can put the 7* C bushings in (does this make sense?) to get me back to the correct castor? now i have 4" and 7* and thats supposed to be right with no drop brackets right? its late, sorry if it makes no sense. AXE

Originally posted by axaviere
i am going to use a jig as well as measuring the D44s <O> distance around its points and making the D60 <O> the same. like the band/hose clamp you have on your <O> deals in that pic Zach. if i get it the same i can just skip the spacers. in my application it shouldnt be that hard to do. grinding sucks huh? oh yeah. i think i will get a set of 4* C bushings and fit the axle with them and set the castor at 4* (is that a coincidence?) so if i want to go 2" higher i can put the 7* C bushings in (does this make sense?) to get me back to the correct castor? now i have 4" and 7* and thats supposed to be right with no drop brackets right? its late, sorry if it makes no sense. AXE

i kinda get you, but your really only gonan bea bel to tell when it all goes under your truck, so just have it tacked when yo put it under the fornt end.

and for you buying a 4wd ranger.
you are supposed to buy a 2wd truck so that way you are not tempted to modify it!
:twak
lol

i got several radius arms, so i can test fit them off the truck. as long as the circumference of the <O> section is the same, it should be bolt in. luckily my <O>'s have the trac bar already built in. i can measure the stock setup and duplicate the whole geometry off the vehicle just to get close. i have to swap out an arm thats slightly bent also and i want to put the wristed arm on when the axle goes in or before, but i like to do stuff once if possible. i dont want to tack weld anything until i get it set right. that way i can rotate it all easily. well as easily as you can rotate that heavy bastard. i have to find a level spot, load up the axle, my welder and everything i could possibly need, drive to the flat spot and do it on my days off, and have it ready to drive to work the next day. and you know that 4x2 is a good idea, except have you seen auto fabs 4x2 F100? made me want to buy another 70's F150 w/ a 460 and pre-runner it. oh well, one truck at a time. AXE

Originally posted by dblue351
exactly, but if you do not want to use wedges between the rad arms the two end of the c-cups need to touch each other.
i dont think it can...
if they are supposed to touch on a stock EB with 2 3/4" tube how can this work?
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=85324&toggle=fullsize&filename=DSC01192.jpg
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=85325&toggle=fullsize&filename=DSC01193.jpg

i spoke to bill, he says they should not touch and that you have about an inch more grinding to do zach, but that you are on the right track. Just keep grinding and trail fiting until the radius arm is on there snugly with the bushings.
As for the caster/camber, once you get everything fit properly, before you weld it, just turn the axle like I told you to set the pinion angle properly.

My buddy did his 60 swap with the radius arm setup. He had the same problem with the tabs. With about 3/4 of an inch to grind off... we got lazy and took them to a machine shop and had them machine them for the 3 1/8 D60 tube. Saved about 3-4 hours of werk on our part, and didnt cost too much if i remember. Run into any more problems, we just finished his a few weeks ago.

Ahhh you are right. Buyt still more grinding then I wanted to do!

i was gonna hev it machined, but then said nah, i just made the spacers like dave....

note to self...find a machine shop.

well im coming into this conversation a bit late but it doesnt look like I missed much :goodfinge whiners. But anyway i have came across a 1990 dana 60 front end with a air locker and 4.10's for 1250. I wanted to know how big of a pita it would be to fit it under my 79 bronco with the stock radius arms. and it sounds like i just grind the piss outa the spring mount on the driver side and a bit out of the <0> to make it all fit snug and then weld the piss outa it? a bunch of the pictures i was hoping to look at arent here anymore so can anyone repost them? I was also thinking about just building my own radius arms out of tube and heims but then i have to make some sort of "y" shaped arm to keep the axle from rotating and that just seems to lead to a 4 link and coilover shocks and a bunch of other stuff i dont want to do. so back to the grinding issue. is this axle worth the trouble or just find a 78/79 dana 60? Any one have some pics further into the install of the later model axle's? Thanks
Mike

ok your differential isnt going to line up. it may not make a big difference, but then again it might. the air (ARB?) is a good deal. if you look on ebay, you kind find a 78-79 axle for close to what your paying for that but it wont have an ARB. im sure others will chime in, AXE

based on how ford mixed and matched t-cases and front axles, and how many people swap old axles into newer trucks, I'd say the slight offset of the front diff would not be a problem.

ill work on reposting th pic tonight and tommorow.

so the differiantly doesnt line up, is it off to the driver side or to the passengerside? With the dana 44 that is in there i have problems with the drive shaft hitting my headers as it is. so if the diff is pushed further over towards the passenger side i really have problems. Is the whole axle centered? or is the whole thing off to one side to get the arms to fit in there?

my 87 D60 setup for my bronco
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=84998&toggle=fullsize&filename=DSC01191.jpg
more pics in my prfile, sig line

now the way my 78 D60 is setup on the drier side
hard to see, but my 78 has about 3-4" more tube on the drivers side
http://www.superford.org/getfile.php?id=84982&toggle=fullsize&filename=DSC01277.jpg

hey badass did you leave them that far apart? or did you keep grinding untill the two halfs touched? If you left them that far apart i am just wondering how well the radius arms mount to it.... or is the spacers people were talking about just go inbetween the two halfs and you redrill the lower spring retainer to match? What electrode did you use to weld it all up?

Thanks

mike, no it's actually further over toward the driver side, so it might help your header interference problem. ford did it like this to clear the ttb crossmember, and it's about as far over as it'll go!