DIY: E4OD Torque Converter Manual Lockup [Archive] - FSB Forums

: DIY: E4OD Torque Converter Manual Lockup


Tommy R
02-03-2007, 06:29 PM
This has come up from time to time and since my info. on it is buried in my gauge install thread I thought it might be best to post the info here in its own thread. :D

So the idea behind this is to install a switch that can manually override the unlocking of the torque converter. As y'all likely know, with the E4OD, if you just lift your foot off the throttle the converter unlocks. When you touch the throttle again the revs pick up while the converter locks up and the revs come back down. Don't believe me? Try it. ;)

Of course, this is a nuisance and generates torque converter heat. I don't know about y'all, but I want to keep my E4OD alive for as long as possible! So a buddy of mine told me a trick. Bill at http://www.dfuser.com/ told me that if I tap a wire leading to the tranny and ground it through a switch that I can manually lock the converter. Intrigued, I decided to research it more and went for it.

It's painfully simple for something that might otherwise seem rather daunting.

1. Locate a large wire bundle under the truck next to the transmission. Look for a purple/yellow wire. On my '96 there was only one and I only found it after cleaning off the wires. They were dirty. ;)

2. Tap into that wire and run the wire up to your dash area or wherever you want to install a switch to control the converter. I mounted mine on the dash like such....

http://www.reganracing.com/bronco/switch.jpg

3. Mount the wire to the switch and ground the other tab on the switch so that when you flip the switch it will ground that wire. The grounding of the purple/yellow wire is what locks the converter.

That's it!

Now my buddy, Bill, sells a really cool switch. It's a three position toggle switch. When I flip the toggle down, it locks the converter. So even lifting off the gas or hitting the brake, the converter stays locked. It's great on the highway when you're in traffic, but never going very slowly.

When I flip the toggle up, it also locks the converter, but you have to hold the toggle up or it will return to center/off. It's called a momentary switch. Anyway, Bill sells them and they're cheap! Comes in handy if you're going to go up a big hill or something and want the converter locked for just a brief period of time.

The only thing to watch for is if you forget to unlock the converter and you go slow enough, you may trip your check engine light. I did it once when I forgot and slowed down to 10-15 mph!! WAY too slow. Keep in mind normally my converter won't lock until 27-28 mph. I got Advance Auto to clear it for me and all's well. Sometimes the CEL will just go off after a day or two, but it doesn't harm anything as far as I know. I only had it reset once. The two other times I did it, the light eventually just went off. I've also had the O/D light flash on the stalk a couple times, but it's not too common.

Bill's been doing this trick for his customers for years. It's super handy, informative, and will help me preserve my tranny.

I got a little fancy with my gauge install. I wired a green LED next to my tranny temp gauge. The toggle switch will also provide a ground for the LED and so it illuminates whenever the converter is locked....so I don't forget too often to unlock it as I slow down. :D

http://www.reganracing.com/bronco/bronco_006s.jpg

Tommy

And here's the gauge install thread for those interested. (http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=79817&highlight=gauge+install+tommy)

Tommy R
02-03-2007, 11:43 PM
Oh, I should also point out that this worked on my '96. I have no idea if this works for other model years or other trannies. And standard disclaimers apply. Do all this at your own risk and if your stuff blows up, don't blame me!! ;)

imlikeojnow
02-04-2007, 06:38 AM
i thought that is what the overdrive odd button on the end of the shifter was for.

Tommy R
02-04-2007, 11:09 AM
i thought that is what the overdrive odd button on the end of the shifter was for.

Nope. That button merely locks out overdrive or lets the tranny use it. It has nothing to with the torque converter.

Tommy

stangmata
02-04-2007, 01:02 PM
Nope. That button merely locks out overdrive or lets the tranny use it. It has nothing to with the torque converter.

Tommy

The OD light just pulls you out of 4th gear into 3rd and engages engine braking.

It would also be cool to stop the converter from locking all together.

Tommy R
02-04-2007, 01:19 PM
Ian, that's what I meant. Maybe my wording wasn't clear. :) No idea how to keep the converter from locking, though.

Oh, BTW Ian, let me know if you're still interested in that manifold I made. I can bring it to the MnG next weekend.

Tommy

bossind
02-04-2007, 08:30 PM
Nice write up Tommy, guess I don't understand the function of the lockup torque converter enough to appreciate this mod. I assume when its locked up it becomes solid with no slippage so it would be more like a clutch setup. (Solid with no slippage between the engine and trans) If that’s the case than I can understand the heat reduction and would think there would be some gas mileage improvement over a regular non-locking torque converter.

Ok guess I do see how this mod would be beneficial after all.

F250 n yz250
02-04-2007, 09:59 PM
what if instead of taping into it you cut the wire, ran speaker wire up to a 3 position switch, having one position be locked, the other being unlocked, and the other have the computer controll it?

locked would be having the wire grounded, unlocked would just break the path in the wire, and computer controlling would just be to connect the switch back to its factory path. Not sure if this would throw a CEL tho :scratchhe

Mudd_Slinger92
02-04-2007, 10:02 PM
Great write up Tommy, someone probably already asked, but where did you get your guage pod from. (The panel holding the guages) Im on the boat with Bossind, dont really no the benefits of the MOD, so I wouldnt no what it could do. Thanks man

DcSkater602
02-04-2007, 10:52 PM
autometer sells them...ill eb doing this soon... btw im still trying to figure out if the 92-96 a pillars are the same...autometer only makes the 3 pod for the 92-96...i have a 91:doh

dc

Bronco4Life
02-05-2007, 06:20 AM
Nice write up Tommy, guess I don't understand the function of the lockup torque converter enough to appreciate this mod. I assume when its locked up it becomes solid with no slippage so it would be more like a clutch setup. (Solid with no slippage between the engine and trans) If thatís the case than I can understand the heat reduction and would think there would be some gas mileage improvement over a regular non-locking torque converter.

Ok guess I do see how this mod would be beneficial after all.

Correct, when you hit the set point on your EEC, it's locked. On my truck it happens right at about 34mph. It'd be nice to lock it at about 25mph when I'm cruising through my city I'm a firefighter in, since the speed limit is only 25.

Tommy R
02-05-2007, 07:52 AM
Only have a minute (heading to work), but Bill at DFUser.com sells the pods (painted to match, no less!), the gauges, and the nifty 3 position switch that I couldn't find locally. I got all my stuff through him. If you call, be sure to throw my name around. You might get a better deal. :D

Oh, and Steve, you pretty much nailed the benefits of the manual locking of the converter. Essentially it's for tranny longevity....which is something everyone here's concerned about!

Tommy

California Monkey
04-11-2007, 06:42 PM
I was curious if anyone knows if this will work on earlier E4OD transmissions.

SigEpBlue
04-13-2007, 02:57 AM
It'll work on ANY E4OD transmission. All of them use a TCC line to lock the converter clutch.


I'll be using a scheme to only lock the converter under the following conditions:
1. 4th gear (OD) is engaged, so obviously highway speed > 40mph
2. A slight delay after OD is engaged
3. TCC lockup in 3rd if a certain time period has passed (or maybe temperature exceeded)
4. Manual engagement/disengagement is always possible

This will all be done with switches, sensors, relays, a 555 timer, and/or a microcontroller if I'm feeling nerdy.

OwlStu
07-14-2007, 12:34 AM
Would manual TC lockup switch make it posible to push start? If so that would be ultra cool and to me a great reason for this mod. :clap :cool: :rockon

:usa

Tommy R
07-14-2007, 03:47 PM
Would manual TC lockup switch make it posible to push start? If so that would be ultra cool and to me a great reason for this mod. :clap :cool: :rockon

:usa

In theory, yes. Not sure it'd work in practice, though.

California Monkey
07-14-2007, 07:46 PM
wow, that would be cool to push start a bronco. It would have to be in Neutral when parked to make it easier to push but I also think that part of the lock-up mechanism works off of adding line pressure in which case youd have to have your tranny spinning in order to have pressure.

SigEpBlue
07-15-2007, 03:00 AM
It wouldn't work. You still need hydraulic pressure from the front pump to enable engagement of the transmission's clutch packs. Otherwise it's free-wheeling internally. Good thought, though.

amraam840
07-15-2007, 03:27 PM
This sounds good but I can't figure out how it helps us. You mentioned it makes the tranny run cooler and I had to wiki that to figure that out but even they couldn't explain to me how locking the converter helps. I mean to ask..

1. Under what conditions would I want to lock and then when would I unlock the converter?
2. Will this allow me to use the engine as a brake to slow down like when driving a manual?
3. Does it improve or reduce fuel economy (not really concerned there)?

Bronco4Life
07-15-2007, 10:08 PM
This sounds good but I can't figure out how it helps us. You mentioned it makes the tranny run cooler and I had to wiki that to figure that out but even they couldn't explain to me how locking the converter helps. I mean to ask..

1. Under what conditions would I want to lock and then when would I unlock the converter?
2. Will this allow me to use the engine as a brake to slow down like when driving a manual?
3. Does it improve or reduce fuel economy (not really concerned there)?

At speeds lower then ~35mph, the TC is unlocked. When it's unlocked, the transfer of power is through the fluid. When it's locked, it's not. When you're compressing the fluid to push it through the fins in the TC, it's generating a lot of heat.

So basically, if you're cruising around town at about 30mph, and the TC never locks, it's going to make some heat, or if you're in something soft like sand, it's gonna make even more.

The conditions in which you'd want to lock and unlock tend to vary depending on the situation and terrain. But as long as you understand what the TC does, and when it makes heat, you should be able to figure it out.

Yeah, it can help you. I do downshift with my trans, and as far as I've seen in third, and second, it does stay locked, but when I go to first, it's unlocked.

I guess it can improve economy like if you're driving around town slow for a long period of time, but I don't really know, it's hard to say.

amraam840
07-16-2007, 11:34 AM
okay. so to tell when it's getting hot, I could watch my trans temp gauge? or is the fluid in the torque converter totally seperate?

California Monkey
07-16-2007, 11:57 AM
It's all the same fluid.

I'd like to do it because the T/C locks at the worst time and in my town, most of the speeds are 35-40 mph so it's always locking and unlocking, locking and unlocking. When it locks and i'm just barely going faster than when it locks, the engine has a hard time and grumbles (running 32" tires) and so then I have to speed up or slowdown. Pain in the ass.

redneckcowboy28
07-22-2007, 02:31 PM
ok now this is just a thought and i am not sure if it would work or not any suggestions would be great.......our speedometers are electronic controlled on an e40d also correct? so is there a way to wire to the speedo that it would auto lock and unlock at say 25mph??? this was just a thought but would greatly help if it would cuz then ya wouldnt have to remember to shut it off specially with idiots in hondas running round lol

Bronco4Life
07-22-2007, 02:48 PM
ok now this is just a thought and i am not sure if it would work or not any suggestions would be great.......our speedometers are electronic controlled on an e40d also correct? so is there a way to wire to the speedo that it would auto lock and unlock at say 25mph??? this was just a thought but would greatly help if it would cuz then ya wouldnt have to remember to shut it off specially with idiots in hondas running round lol

There's no way to "wire" it up. You'd have to build a logic circuit that takes the output of the speedo, and when it reaches the output tick of whatever value you want it at, the logic circuit would trigger a relay that would enable the TC lock.

I remember Sig saying he was working up some silly circuit with a timer, which IMO is retarded, because having switches that you have to control manually is for cool people. :twak :goodfinge

SigEpBlue
07-22-2007, 04:57 PM
Uh huh, and I was going to use one of these little 555 timer guys:

http://www.positiveoffset.com/Parts/555-CMOS-Timer.jpg

and use something to modify the amount of time (or speed/gear) it waits to implement lockup.

But yes, I'm not cool enough for manual control of switches. That shit's just outta my league.

vegard
07-24-2007, 03:10 PM
Just curious -- what happens if I forget to unlock the TC? I'm worried about possibly damaging the transmission if the gear box shifts up/down with the TC lock engaged. If not damaging it, it would be sort of a hard shift I guess?

Bronco4Life
07-24-2007, 03:39 PM
Just curious -- what happens if I forget to unlock the TC? I'm worried about possibly damaging the transmission if the gear box shifts up/down with the TC lock engaged. If not damaging it, it would be sort of a hard shift I guess?

No, you won't damage the transmission. If you come to a stop with it locked, you'll stall out. Yes, you'll get rougher/firmer shifts. I'm not exactly sure, but when I mash on the pedal with the shifter in first, and when it gets to ~5200rpm, and slap it into second, I believe the TC is locked when it's doing it, and I end up with a good solid shift from first to second. Almost like it has a shift kit in it.

California Monkey
07-24-2007, 04:17 PM
but you would probably damage (by overheating) your T/c if you left it unlocked and headed for the freeway.

drkhrs925
07-24-2007, 07:35 PM
the TC lockup is not designed to take that much torque. It is there for economy. It locks up only while crusing on the highway in overdrive at low throttle positions. the reason for that is to eliminate the slip and therefore the parasidic loss of the converter.

Tommy R
07-24-2007, 07:40 PM
Actually, not quite. The converter can and does lock outside of O/D and it can take fairly high throttle positions....like full throttle. My converter would stay locked at WOT shifts if the converter engaged prior to the upshift. Now granted, normally increasing throttle position substantially will cause an unlock and potentially a downshift, but it'll lock back up before you let out of it.

Tommy

California Monkey
07-24-2007, 07:40 PM
That's right. If your getting on the throttle, It doesn't lock up until you start letting off. It all depends on the circumstances of what your doing when the T/C would normally lock up. I guess that means you wouldn't do damage if you left it unlocked (maybe).

Bronco4Life
08-04-2007, 08:56 PM
the TC lockup is not designed to take that much torque. It is there for economy. It locks up only while crusing on the highway in overdrive at low throttle positions. the reason for that is to eliminate the slip and therefore the parasidic loss of the converter.

That's right. If your getting on the throttle, It doesn't lock up until you start letting off. It all depends on the circumstances of what your doing when the T/C would normally lock up. I guess that means you wouldn't do damage if you left it unlocked
(maybe).

Both incorrect. Maybe on an AOD driven by a TV cable, but not an E4OD.

Actually, not quite. The converter can and does lock outside of O/D and it can take fairly high throttle positions....like full throttle. My converter would stay locked at WOT shifts if the converter engaged prior to the upshift. Now granted, normally increasing throttle position substantially will cause an unlock and potentially a downshift, but it'll lock back up before you let out of it.

Tommy

:stupid

In second gear, if I'm accelerating and gradually pushing the throttle in it will be unlocked and I'll get as far as WOT and see the rpm's drop 2-300 rpm and feel it lock up.

Try this also... In second, get it up around 3 grand at WOT, and then real quick, let off the gas just a hair, and mash it back down quick. You'll see the TC unlock for a second or two, and then lock back up by the time it hits 3500-4000.

well im stumped..i tried this and it didnt work?....what does that mean?...bad torque convertor? i tried bypassing the switch i put in and is see a small arc that would tell me i am grounding it but nothing happens? thanks

Um, well, under normal operation, are you getting a TCC lockup error code?

drkhrs925
08-09-2007, 08:27 PM
interesting I can only compare to my 01 expedidition and a few other cars I have driven in the past. They all locked up only for crusing on the highway and would drop the lock on the first sign of power applied. I would love to tap the line to an led and actually watch the signal while driving. That is the only way to tell what it is actually doing. could be done on the same wire you have the switch on.

Bronco4Life
08-09-2007, 09:48 PM
interesting I can only compare to my 01 expedidition and a few other cars I have driven in the past. They all locked up only for crusing on the highway and would drop the lock on the first sign of power applied. I would love to tap the line to an led and actually watch the signal while driving. That is the only way to tell what it is actually doing. could be done on the same wire you have the switch on.

The newer EEC-V's (4R100/4R70w) have different programming, and yes, like you said, they do that. Though they are still electro-hydraulically applied lockup converters, versus the AOD's, which are controlled by a shaft that physically locks the torque converter to the overdrive gear.

SigEpBlue
08-10-2007, 02:38 PM
Some of the later PCMs use PWM (pulse width modulation) for torque converter lockup control IIRC, so be aware of that when proceeding to monitor the signal!!!

BTW Bronco4Life, I'm leaning away from using a timer and instead implementing a good ol' Allen-Bradley/Rockwell PLC for modifying the converter lockup timing & conditions. We've got a few just taking up space at work anyway, and the ladder programming is so easy a freshman could do it. :toothless

Bronco4Life
08-10-2007, 03:34 PM
We've got a few just taking up space at work anyway, and the ladder programming is so easy a freshman could do it. :toothless

:thumbup:thumbup:thumbup:thumbup


If ya ever get around to building it, post up and let us know how it works out... I might be interested in such a setup.

California Monkey
08-12-2007, 07:15 PM
interesting I can only compare to my 01 expedidition and a few other cars I have driven in the past. They all locked up only for crusing on the highway and would drop the lock on the first sign of power applied. I would love to tap the line to an led and actually watch the signal while driving. That is the only way to tell what it is actually doing. could be done on the same wire you have the switch on.

It won't be the first time I'll have been a test dummy and I'd like to know as well as you. Let me know when you want me to come over for "you" to install that LED. :beer

California Monkey
08-12-2007, 07:18 PM
We've got a few just taking up space at work anyway, and the ladder programming is so easy a freshman could do it. :toothless

It's a good thing those units are getting smaller every year otherwise it would be a huge box to control such a small amount of info. Also, It would probably cost you around $1000 if you did it with the smallest / cheapest PLC if you were buying one to do it new. I'm still learning but I don't do PLc's that often. All the stuff Iv'e used is the automation direct stuff. It's good especially for Newbies. :banghead

USMC_Fords
09-12-2007, 07:05 PM
well i did this and ran into a problem. i ran it and it did fine for a little while. then i come to a stop, and the switch is off, and i stall out. so i start it up, put it in D and stall. flip the switch, start and try again, stall again. did this a couple times with the switch both ways with no luck. so i finally just pulled the wire from the switch and was fine. adny ideas?

SigEpBlue
09-12-2007, 07:45 PM
Your switch may have been underrated for the amperage, and the contacts might've stuck together. Same thing that happens when people try to use plastic switches rated for 20A to control an electric fan without using a relay.

USMC_Fords
09-12-2007, 09:09 PM
it maybe the amperage. its a 10A but i figured that would be enough.

drkhrs925
09-14-2007, 10:49 AM
has anybody ever tried to control one of these without the computer. just wondering if it has been done. I imagine its possible but havn't found anything yet.

California Monkey
09-14-2007, 11:19 AM
You mean lock and un-lock by manual switch only?

drkhrs925
09-19-2007, 06:42 PM
not just the converter lockup, but the whole transmition. I am wondering about puting it behind a non-computer controled engine and setting up a manual shifter of sorts for it.... just playing around with retrofit ideas for older cars.

California Monkey
09-19-2007, 07:06 PM
That would be interesting. Just have a push button gear select with a push button T/C lock-up. It would be like the old VW manual-automatic transmissions. You have to select the gear but there's no clutch.

It's all just signals so i'm sure easier than you'd think. my guess is that it would take 8 wires and 5 switches. (random guess)

bugzappers
09-29-2007, 05:24 PM
This will work for just about any lock up transmission. I have done this to many a4LD as well as AODE and E4OD

redneckcowboy28
09-29-2007, 07:45 PM
not just the converter lockup, but the whole transmition. I am wondering about puting it behind a non-computer controled engine and setting up a manual shifter of sorts for it.... just playing around with retrofit ideas for older cars.

you cant control the tranny itself manually it is electronically controlled but their are stand alone computers for it to be controlled by its own computer and run behind an older engine. i know compu-shift makes one and bauman. hope this helps

SigEpBlue
09-29-2007, 08:08 PM
No, it's very possible to completely control the E4OD without a PCM, but it'd be fairly difficult at best. There's a little more to it than selecting the gear you want. You'd have to monitor and adjust the EPC duty cycle as needed, along with switch CCS as required. It's all possible to come up with an independent controller, but then again, that's supposed to be the PCM's job anyway.

drkhrs925
10-01-2007, 06:52 PM
looks like I will have to break out the schematics when and if I ever decide to play with ont of these. I am an electronics person so the circiut making and Programing wouldn't be hard. What doesn't seem to be out there is What signals are being sent to the trans on what wires. If it is only a matter of engaging the correct solenoid to engage the band or clutch combination that is very easy. You can even work in a pulse width modulation to soften it up. The hard part will be if there is signals that need to be present to regulate the pump output preasure. Like I said before controling electronics is the easy part, interfacing something without acurate shematics and specs... now thats hard and usually leads to smoking one or two before you get what you want

California Monkey
10-01-2007, 07:08 PM
smoking these would be like closing a sliding glass door on your yoo-hoo. Pretty much not worth it. You'd be better off getting an AOD with a B&M shifter on it. Way less time and money.

SigEpBlue
10-02-2007, 03:17 AM
I don't think it would be a good idea to PWM the shift solenoids or the coast clutch; that's asking for trouble. The accumulators on each will take care of the transient pressure changes, and modifying those with different spring k-rates is the "accepted" and reliable way of doing it. The EPC however is PWM'ed, and varying the duty cycle is how the PCM regulates line pressure. Very similar scheme to the idle air control used on the engine. It's kinda inverted though: zero PW yields maximum pressure, and full DC gives you minimum pressure. This is another reason using the voltage dividing resistor (as in the B&M kits) is kind of a half-ass solution, IMHO. Sure it works, but then again it's hard to augment PWM, and the only thing you can do is lower the high-level voltage.

The schematics are fully available online, and all you need to do is pull the line from whichever solenoid you want to turn "ON" to ground.

drkhrs925
10-08-2007, 08:41 PM
hey I understood that,,, mkaes more sense now,,, setup a control for the line preasure and a priority encoder (or logic aray) for the solenoids and your in business for a manual control,,, thanks blue. I guess I used the wrong term for what I would need, schematics that tell me wich wires are for what gear I found - but the theory of ops that tells me what each wire caries is missing.

I like turtles too

jtsmith
09-06-2008, 01:14 AM
Hi
I am having heat issues due to a high stall converter, during long steep climbs-
the idea of locking my converter was intriguing enough to ask on another forum and I was linked to your thread-
I was wondering if the speed issue shows up in 4wd low?

this is where i will need the lock up, in 1st and 2nd gear mainly-
I have a 347 with an x cam, in a 98 mountaineer, with a 4406 transfer case swap-between there is a art carr 3000 rpm stall converter-with lock up. Yeah-I know-$$$

if I could just get the trans to run cool I would have it made-
it cools instantly, if the t/c is locked, but heats fast while "stalling" --

it would easily pull uphill in 4wd low, 2nd gear locked up--definitely in 1st locked up-

I'd like the idea of switching it off again, as I think this might help smooth the power, and save a cv axle on slow, high obstacles-which is where axles snap-
the high stall should help give a "slipping clutch " type feel--

Thanks for letting me ramble, and, thanks for your opinion -

Tommy R
09-06-2008, 08:45 AM
Wow, an X cam and 3000 rpm stall in a wheeler? While I believe you could do the converter lock-up switch and it should work in 1st and 2nd gear, I think the real solution would be to properly cam it with a lower stall converter. Then again, if you have an X cam I would imagine you are likely running some big port, high flow heads which would suck for any reasonably sized cam for an offroader. So it would be a lot of work/money you've already spent to correct what you've already done.

It's up to you. I don't know the intended purpose of your truck, though.

Tommy

Ragged_ol_86
02-21-2009, 04:58 PM
94 f350 e4od 5.8. purple/yellow....doesnt work. i have grounds all across the board. what other wire could it be?

Red91XLT
02-21-2009, 10:08 PM
ORANGE & purple...

Er.. don't listen to me, I'm an idiot. It is supposed to be yellow & purple.

DNBELOWBRONCO
02-24-2009, 06:02 PM
Hey guys I'm doing this mod and have a question I can't find a answer to. I bought a toggle switch, from Radio Shack, and it's a (SPST) single pole single throw 30A 12v one. It has three spade terminals on it. One is Power, One is ACC, and One is Ground. I want to have a neon light that comes on like Tommy did but keep it in a single switch if possible. I know the whole point to this is to Ground the TQ wire on the tranny and my question is: do I hook the Ground terminal to a vehicle ground & tap the wire off the tranny onto it, then hook the other two like they say-one to direct power & the other to Acc power or will this interfer with grounding the tranny wire if the switch has "Power" to it also instead of just "Ground" like Tommy states in the beginning of this thread? Or do you just use the "Acc" terminal & the "Ground "and forget the "Power" terminal? Thanks:thumbup-Kevin-

SigEpBlue
02-24-2009, 07:09 PM
Depends upon the current draw of the lamp. Is there a rating?

DNBELOWBRONCO
02-24-2009, 08:43 PM
Depends upon the current draw of the lamp. Is there a rating? It doesn't say anything about current draw just rated 30A. Part number is 275-0024 from Radioshack.com good picture of it but under specs it just says voltage 12VDC.

SigEpBlue
02-24-2009, 10:35 PM
Think about what you're doing: completing a circuit, from a live 12VDC line to chassis ground, right? Complete THAT circuit first. THEN do whatever is needed for the LED. I have no idea on your switch why they would label things that way; it would've been more clear to mold a circuit diagram into the side of the switch or something of how the LED is connected.

DNBELOWBRONCO
02-24-2009, 11:26 PM
Think about what you're doing: completing a circuit, from a live 12VDC line to chassis ground, right? Complete THAT circuit first. THEN do whatever is needed for the LED. I have no idea on your switch why they would label things that way; it would've been more clear to mold a circuit diagram into the side of the switch or something of how the LED is connected. I understand the way Tommy is explaining how to do it, basically just using the switch as a fancy ground. Same as if you connected a wire into the tranny wire and touched the other end to the vehicle to ground it & lock up the converter. I'm just not sure if using a switch that connects to Power also, effects this mod since he is just using the switch to ground the TQ and has (or had) a separate light on his piller pod to let him know the switch is on. The led he had has power to it and only uses the Negative side from the switch to provide a ground, mine has the led on the tip of the switch so will the switch keep the power separate and away from the TQ? The switch looks pretty basic like tons of other 3 spade switches I've seen before. Now that I read this I think I'm worring too much. The "Power terminal" is connected to the fuse panel (switched or constant power, my choice to run the LED) the "Acc terminal" would be used if I wanted to run it to power something, but in this case I don't want to, and the "Ground" is connected to the body AND also to the trans wire to do this TQ lock out mod, right Sig?

DNBELOWBRONCO
02-24-2009, 11:51 PM
Actually that won't work because he's probably using a two spade switch so one end connects to the body ground and the other to the wire that connects to the TQ. If I use only one side and ground it and splice it into the TQ wire the TQ will be grounded constantly which I don't want to do. The problem is that I understand basically how a two spade switch works, just interupting the flow of current or ground. I also get how a three spade works if you want to run power to something. With this switch I could use the power lead at one end to connect to the body, use the opposite end to connect to the TQ wire but I don't know how to get power to the LED when the TQ is locked?? On Tommy's the LED has power to it by it'self and turns on when the switch is flipped on and the ground is completed because it shares the ground with the switch. Since this is a grounding MOD maybe I can't use a lighted switch, maybe I have to use a serarate LED mounted next to it...

SigEpBlue
02-25-2009, 09:52 AM
Like I said, complete the circuit function first. Worry about the LED later.

You could've made it much easier by simply posting the picture of the silly thing:
http://rsk.imageg.net/graphics/product_images/pRS1C-2160437w345.jpg

If it's wired like I think it is, the "Ground" terminal should be connected to both chassis ground AND the "ACC" terminal. Connect the TCC line to "Power".

DNBELOWBRONCO
02-25-2009, 12:49 PM
I'm thinking this is a waste of a good switch and maybe I should just go buy a 2 terminal switch & a single LED light, like Tommy, and just save this for something else since it seems like I have to almost bypass the LED to make it work! Thanks Sig..:thumbup-Kevin-

wik
02-25-2009, 01:42 PM
I did this a few years ago in my Super Duty. I have a box of relays and harnesses laying around, so I used one. My lighted switch just powers the relay which grounds the wire to the transmission.

DNBELOWBRONCO
02-25-2009, 03:57 PM
Just got off the phone with Bill from Dfuser, the guy Tommy deals with, and he confirmed that since the switch is only being used as a grounding connection that I should use a non-lighted switch to be safe. Also for anyone doing this Mod when asked he said that a 10 amp switch is more than enough, so any Plain Jane toggle at RadioShack would be fine. Just run a separate LED if you want to know when it's on. Thanks for everyones help!! :thumbup-Kevin-
UPS just dropped off my Explorer overhead console so it's off to install both of these....

**Added a few pictures on my Supermotors site about the install. Works awesome and the LED light turns on when the TQ locks up even without turning the switch on, so you can monitor when it does it automatically!***

Click Here to view:
http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/711444/thumbnail/torque-converter-lockout-mod-001.jpg (http://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/711444)

liltimmy08
12-17-2009, 07:15 AM
Will this work on my 96 powerjoke? Or would the wiring be different?

hav24wheel
12-30-2009, 02:10 PM
I'm getting ready to do this mod, but I'm in the planning stages right now. Tryin to get a good mental picture of how to run the wires for what I want to do, I bought a on-off-on switch, and a indicator light. I want to hook the switch up, so that I have Stock-unlocked-Locked for the convertor. The way I understand this, is cut the purple/yellow wire from the trans, that wire would go to the middle prog on the switch, than hook one of the remaining prongs to the other end of the wire that was cut, that end goes to the computer. Than the last prong goes to a good ground. But where would I hook the indicator light? I want it to light up when ever the convertor is locked,(when computer locks it with the switch in "normal" and when I switch it to locked) So, would I just hook the indicator lamp to the middle prong and to a ground?

here is a crappy pic i made in paint. Would it work like this or not?
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=5543&pictureid=22596

SomeDude451
12-30-2009, 03:48 PM
No that wouldn't. The indicator light would constantly ground out the purple/ yellow wire, leaving your torque converter always locked up.

Here's what your looking for:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v712/somedude451/modifiedswitchdiagram-1.jpg


In the "up" on position the wire is stock, and whenever the computer makes the connection, the light is illuminated. In the "down" on position, the wire is grounded, torque converter locked, and light illuminated.

I'm pretty sure that's right.

hav24wheel
12-30-2009, 03:56 PM
That's kinda what I thought too. - was tryin to figure out how prople are hooking up a indicator light, but it just didn't make sence t me. Thanks for the help.

SomeDude451
12-30-2009, 03:59 PM
I've corrected my post to include a diagram that should work out the way you want it to.

hav24wheel
12-30-2009, 04:07 PM
Wow! I must have had one major brain fart goin on today. I was tryin to make it too complicated. Lol. Thanks a lot. I might try it out this weekend.

hav24wheel
12-30-2009, 04:16 PM
Wait, what's the amperage that runs through that wire? Less than 10, so I guess I'd hope that it wouldn't burn out the light.

b0bj0e
04-23-2010, 08:08 PM
So I've completed the mod, and am running a 14 gauge splice through a two pole 15A switch. I am concerned my torque converter is not fully locking.

Prior to this mod I believe I reached the limits of the tranny temperature (no gauge though) during a long mountain decent at ~20 MPH. Only after descending the mountain and traveling at highway speeds for 2 hours did I notice strange behavior at low speeds. There was intermittent slippage when in gear and rough engagement of the TC when shifting in second or first gear. The sypmtoms were gone after the truck sat overnight and cooled.

That was about a week ago. When I "ground" the converter, by way of this modification, I am barley able to perceive any difference. I know the wiring is solid, and that the torque converter does lock, but "lockup" fails at speeds lower than roughly the programmed "unlock" speed threshold (~35 MPH). I can come to a stop with the TC "locked" and nothing happens, downshifts occur like the TC is unlocked.

Any ideas? Perhaps I should wire the circuit like SomeDude451 described in post #69.

Ebony Mule
02-05-2011, 06:09 PM
not just the converter lockup, but the whole transmition. I am wondering about puting it behind a non-computer controled engine and setting up a manual shifter of sorts for it.... just playing around with retrofit ideas for older cars.

This is exactly the help I need. I'm using this tranmission in a hunting buggy. Is there anyway I can activate the solenoids manually . I'm really not worried about speed or automatic shifting. Also would I ground the wires or make them hot to active them ? I have a Haynes manual with the wiring schematic. PS No computer on truck as I have converted it to carb's and HEI ignition. Thanks

dch1992
06-04-2011, 12:18 AM
i would love to do this mod but my town has way to many stop lights no long roads at all

pdmoney
08-20-2011, 10:00 AM
I have a 1996 F150 5.8L 4X4 with the E4OD. I do not have any switch to enable or disable the OD. It only has one position: OD....Is there any way to add a switch to it to prevent it from shifting into OD? I came across this as I was looking online for the lockout mods people were talking about.

Thanks,

Paul

Big RIck
08-20-2011, 10:22 AM
If you don't have a button at the end of your shifter to turn off the OD, your truck didn't come with an E4OD. Did you do a swap and not install the button?

DNBELOWBRONCO
08-20-2011, 08:11 PM
If you don't have a button at the end of your shifter to turn off the OD, your truck didn't come with an E4OD. Did you do a swap and not install the button?

Yeah, that's what I was wondering too. If you don't have a button there then you must have a hole with the bezal and switch/button asy missing. When I grounded the trans harness wire I just used a connector that "Taps" on to the wire like the typical blue ones, but I found a red one that clips on and has a spade connector on it, in case you need to un-clip the ground wire from it. I just used a plain switch and separate led light from Radio Shack, check my Supermotor Site for pics.....All the wire that runs down to the trans does it manually "Ground" the torque converter and lock it up by way of the wiring harness...
Here's a pic from my site. The lower switch with the red dot is something else......:thumbup -Kevin-

**In a nut shell. My switch has 2 spade terminals on it & the led has two wires coming out of it, red & black.
Run power to the red wire. Run a ground to the "OFF" position on the switch. Run the wire from the trans & the black wire to the "ON" position on the switch. That's it! The led will light up about 28-30 mph, when the torque converter automatically locks up and when you throw the switch and reach that speed.....
REMEMBER: Turn it off before you "SLOW DOWN" to 30 mph or you will stall the motor out when you come to a stop.....!!

www.supermotors.net/registry/17883http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/711450/fullsize/torque-converter-lockout-mod-010.jpg