Bronco Forum - Full Size Ford Bronco Forum banner

Starter solenoid?

2K views 22 replies 8 participants last post by  Alvin in AZ 
#1 ·
My son's '95 had a dead battery, he jumped it and got all the lights and buzzers to come on. While it was still jumped, he moved the key the first position and all was well, when he moved it to the crank position everything went dead. No lights, no buzzers or anything, completely dead while still jumped. What's going on here? Tomorrow I'm heading down to the college to check it out and would like to know what I'm up against. Thanks!
 
#6 ·
The thing that gets me is that while its being jumped and the key is turned to the crank position, everything dies.
And that right there it's why I'm believing it's a dirty or loose connection
 
#12 ·
Same to you! A little birdie told me some positive rumors have been swirling around your company and may bode well for my future?

Anyway post up some more questions if you have em. Seems like a simple fix, even if the diagnosis may be a little complicated.
 
#14 ·
Wanted to post this for you last night but wife and daughter were doing
homework on this computer. :)

-----------------------------------------------------

Here's my way of doing it... YMMV

1) It's messing up?
Don't mess with any wires etc get the analog meter out first-thing!
That's so you won't "clear-up the trouble on yourself" and then won't know
what needs fixing. BTDT and BTSeenThat both. :/ Do yourself a favor and
let the voltmeter do its job before you go monkeying with it. ;)

2) Read the battery voltage by digging the voltmeter's leads into the
battery's terminals (not the clamps;). Should read ~12 volts.

3) Have a helper try to start the vehicle. I've done this by myself, so don't
tell me you can't too. ;) But a helper's cool you can teach the helper how
to trouble shoot a starting/charging system while you're at it.

4) Watch to see how far down the needle goes...
Less that 10 volts and sounds sluggish or don't turn over? --> 4a
Don't move really, stays at ~12 volts and don't turn over? --> 4b
Drops to ~11 volts and starter sounds good and engine starts fine? --> 5

5) After it starts, does the voltage stay at ~12 volts or rise to ~13 volts?
If it just sits there at the original voltage then you got charging circuit
trouble could be the alternator or the voltage regulator or both.
Alternators can be fixed, BTW. ;)

The trick is to first try it on a vehicle that's working fine to see it in action.

An analog voltmeter is all you need.

4a) Typically you've got a good connection through the whole starter's
circuit and got a low or weak battery.
How old is the battery?
A brand-new battery can be bad, BTDT.

4b) Typically you got an "open circuit" (as opposed to a "short circuit")
and the analog meter will find it for you if you-let-it-lead-you to it.
In steps, move the leads closer to the "load" (the starter) until you get
virtually-zero-volts (when the helper tries to start the engine). Use little
bitty steps as you narrow in on -exactly- where the open-circuit-is. ;)

-----------------------------------------------------

Alvin in AZ
 
#16 ·
One eazy thing to do is to hook the neg jumper cable to the engine (instead of the battery post) If it starts, Its the ground between the battery and engine. If it still doesnt start, Hook the pos jumper cable to the start soliniod or right to the starter. (becareful about the engine turning over) If it starts, the problem is in that cercuet.
 
#17 ·
Battery voltage 12.27, with it running 14.45v. Drove almost 2 hrs to get there, all I did was test the battery, put the key in and cranked it. Fired right up. My son's jaw hit the ground. I did poke around looking for loose or corroded connections but couldn't find any. He's coming home on Friday for Xmas break, so I'll have more time to tinker. Thanks for everyone's input, gotta hunch that I'm not done.
 
#21 ·
Alvin, I bought the battery about 6 mos ago. The previous one, if I recall correctly, was about 6 yrs old. It was replaced because it was dead, (or maybe not). The rig had been sitting for a few months in my driveway, I bought it for my 14 yr old so unless he takes midnight joy rides, it hadn't been driven. I let my oldest take it back to skool because his '91 needed a new water pump and timing set. Sorry for the dissertation, maybe there's dots to connect and I was thinking and typing at the same time.
 
#22 ·
I had a problem that was very similar with my Mustang a looong time ago. It ended up that I had a corroded battery cable, waay down inside under the rubber. Sometimes it would work, sometimes it would overheat and not work.

Eventually I figured out that if I loosened the battery cables and wiggled everything it would get to the point I could start it. After I replaced the cables I cut them all apart and found the problem. The wires were mostly green powder.
 
#23 ·
...I had a corroded battery cable, waay down inside under the rubber.
Sometimes it would work, sometimes it would overheat and not work.
I figured out that if I loosened the battery cables and wiggled everything
it would get to the point I could start it. After I replaced the cables I cut
them all apart and found the problem. The wires were mostly green
powder.
Cool one, Ryan. :)

Know this:
You could've found the problem the first time it sounded -weak- if you
would've put a meter to the system and traced down the partial open
circuit. You would've never broke down even one time from it.

Believe it? :)

Also if you would've put a little motor oil on the connections when new
and did it in such a way that the motor oil ran in under the insulation a
little, that set of battery cables would still be working good.

Believe it? :)

Just a 1/4 teaspoon on each one when you change the engine oil. That
don't sound too hard to do does it? ;)

Replaced the original (really-small! 8 gauge?) battery cables off my '75
F150 at 150k miles in the mid 90's. They were still good, just my buddy
wanted me to replace 'em because they looked so little an' Micky Mouse!

Micky Mouse or not, they still worked good as new because they'd never
corroded. :)

-----------------------------------


See that little cable clamp at the rear of the big clamp?
Found -lots- of those too open to operate the starter.
One day found both of them bad on the same battery. LOL :)

The coolest part of it for me was she was at the scrap yard and all the
guys there (workers and customers) were voicing an opinion on what
was causing the trouble. Many of them were agreeing with each other
and "patting each other on the back" for their diagnosis too. LOL :)

Not a single one mentioned the little clamps because they looked-clean
they had to be good, see? ...take a guess who walked over with a cheap
analog meter and found the trouble with no-guessing and quicker than
it takes to read this post. xD

Using a meter to find electrical trouble really does work.

Believe it? ;)

Steve83's got a write up showing how to solder cables to get rid of
those sorry things.

The little clamp looks to be too small, but I've always wondered if it
wouldn't work good if the plate and bolts were bronze and kept oily.

Alvin in AZ
ps-
BTW, this is a starter relay...
http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/starterRelay.jpg

That round thing on the side of the starter motor is a starter solenoid...
http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/starterDelco.jpg
...it could be called a "Delco" I guess? It was invented by Delco. :)
It doesn't have to have a starter relay because it can be controlled by
a light-duty ignition switch. The positive battery cable goes directly to
the big terminal there on the starter solenoid.

These Ford starters need a starter relay because they don't have the
starter solenoid on 'em...
http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/starters351w.jpg
...that's a manual transmission starter on the left. :)
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top