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Old 06-14-2011, 11:53 PM   #1
Big RIck
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Odd transmission leak (E4OD)

I did a little light wheeling on Sunday. I got home, parked in the driveway and turned the Bronco off. I unloaded some stuff, then started it back up to move it out of the way because my friend was coming over. I backed it out into the yard and walked back up the driveway and saw this...



I looked under the Bronco and found this...



There was no dripping at all at the beginning of the driveway. Any ideas what may have happened while it was parked there for 5 mins or so that made it spray out like that? I started it up yesterday to move it off the yard to mow...I pulled it up past the first leak site and left it there while I mowed. Once I was done, I pulled it back out onto the yard. There were no leaks or drips or anything. Any ideas? I can't imagine it was a one time fluke situation...
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Old 06-15-2011, 01:04 AM   #2
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First, thanks for those pics, Rick. Missed that the first time you posted them.

Yeah, you have stock radius arms, but the driver side was probably replaced at some point in time. Amazing all that clearance you have. When I flush my brake system, I am going to have to compare my wheel backspace to what you posted.

Hard to tell from that pic, but the fluid on the ground doesn't look red? Is it oil, or tranny fluid? I had oil leaking from the same spot on mine when I had my motor jacked at an angle to drop the oil pan. Leaking stopped once I put the motor back where it it's supposed to go.
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Old 06-15-2011, 03:48 AM   #3
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you probably overheated the transmission. very common on these. get an aftermarket cooler. there are a bajillion threads on it.
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Old 06-15-2011, 07:26 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by "Bronco" John Galt View Post
First, thanks for those pics, Rick. Missed that the first time you posted them.

Yeah, you have stock radius arms, but the driver side was probably replaced at some point in time. Amazing all that clearance you have. When I flush my brake system, I am going to have to compare my wheel backspace to what you posted.

Hard to tell from that pic, but the fluid on the ground doesn't look red? Is it oil, or tranny fluid? I had oil leaking from the same spot on mine when I had my motor jacked at an angle to drop the oil pan. Leaking stopped once I put the motor back where it it's supposed to go.
No problem.

It is definitely red. I guess I should have taken a pic of my finger after I picked some up to check the color...

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Originally Posted by TheUnforgiven View Post
you probably overheated the transmission. very common on these. get an aftermarket cooler. there are a bajillion threads on it.
In that situation would it just blow out like that and then seal back up? Or would that front seal need to be replaced? If the seal needs to be replaced, can you just unbolt the front and slide it in or does the trans need to come down?

I will search on trans coolers. I had a suspicion that could have been what happened but I wanted more experienced opinions.
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Old 06-15-2011, 09:43 AM   #5
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An aftermarket cooler {huge B&M cooler} cured my trans leaking problem. Mine was doing the exact same thing as yours-
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Old 06-15-2011, 10:00 AM   #6
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No problem.

It is definitely red. I guess I should have taken a pic of my finger after I picked some up to check the color...



In that situation would it just blow out like that and then seal back up? Or would that front seal need to be replaced? If the seal needs to be replaced, can you just unbolt the front and slide it in or does the trans need to come down?

I will search on trans coolers. I had a suspicion that could have been what happened but I wanted more experienced opinions.


Mine did the same thing after its first real long trip in heat. I was told it has a vent up top and probably just shit right out of that hole. Mine was dripping from the bell housing but front seal appeared fine.

It drove perfectly fine the whole way and ever since. So we assume I had it a bit over-filled (I admit this is possible) and so it heated up and pooped out the top.

I am waiting for my cooler to come in the mail to hopefully rectify the issue.

You hear about E4ODs being used in motor homes, yet it overheats in a Bronco while towing nothing? At that point in my mind it has to be inadequete cooling. I hope.
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Old 06-15-2011, 10:29 AM   #7
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Yup, They will overheat in a bronco while towing nothing. ALL automatic transmissions have improper cooling ! Every automatic transmission that I have installed an aftermarket transmission cooler on {along with the factory cooling } has exhibited better shifting characteristics {no more mushy shifting from heat} and trans fluid leaks stopped or were much less. Motors like heat, Transmissions are killed by it-
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Old 06-15-2011, 11:14 AM   #8
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yo,

Leakage Inspection in a 96 from 1996 Bronco with E4OD Automatic Transmission Workshop Manual
Source: by Ford via miesk5

Item Part Number Description
1 7902 Converter Assembly
2 87650-S2 Converter Drain Plug
3 7L323 Front Pump Support Seal
4 7A248 Front Pump Seal Assembly
5 7D441 Front Pump Square Cut O.D. Seal
6 N805260-S Bolt and Washer Assembly
7 7G379 Washer
8 7A136 Pump Gasket
9 7A020 Fluid Level Indicator
10 7A228 Fluid Filler Tube Assembly
11 391308-S Filler Tube O-Ring
12 7N463 Short Fluid Inlet Tube Assembly
13 7005 Case
14 7034 Vent Assembly
15 7D273 Fluid Tube Inlet Connector
16 7D174 Converter Drain Back Check Valve Assembly — Rear
17 7086 Extension Housing Gasket
18 7A039 Extension Housing (4x2)
19 7052 Extension Housing Seal
20 7A039 Extension Housing (4x4)
21 7H183 Extension Housing Plug
22 7B498 Manual Control Lever Oil Seal
23 7G391 Solenoid Valve Body Assembly
24 7A191 Transmission Pan Gasket
25 7A194 Transmission Pan (4x2)



CAUTION: Cork gaskets and elastomeric gaskets are not interchangeable. If you remove a cork gasket, replace it with a cork gasket. If you remove an elastomeric gasket, clean, inspect and reuse unless gasket is damaged. Be careful not to cut or bend elastomeric gasket.

NOTE: A unique transmission pan and pan retaining bolts are required to use the new elastomeric gasket for past model service. The cork style gasket will be retained for past model service where a new transmission pan is not required. If the transmission pan is damaged and requires replacement, a kit will be available. This kit will contain a transmission pan, elastomeric gasket and 20 pan bolts having an increased thread length to accommodate current and past model usage.



If transmission is equipped with a cork gasket, discard it and install a new gasket. If transmission is equipped with the new elastomeric reusable gasket, clean, inspect and reuse unless damaged.

Leakage at the transmission pan to case gasket often can be stopped by tightening the attaching bolts to 14-16 Nm (10-12 lb-ft). Service the pan gasket as required.

leakage is found by the solenoid body connector, refer to Main Control Valve Body in the In-Vehicle Service portion of this section. Replace O-ring on the connector snout of the solenoid body assembly.

Check the transmission fluid filler tube connection at the transmission case. If leakage is found here, install a new short fluid inlet tube.

CAUTION: Do not try to stop the fluid leak by increasing the torque beyond specification. This may cause damage to the case threads.

Check the transmission fluid lines and fittings between the transmission and the fluid inlet short tube in the radiator tank for looseness, wear, or damage. If leakage cannot be stopped by tightening a fluid line tube nut, replace the damaged parts. When fluid is found to be leaking between the case and the cooler line fitting, tighten the fitting to maximum specification. Refer to Fluid Cooler Lines in the In-Vehicle Service portion of this section. If the leak continues, replace the cooler line fitting and tighten to specification. The same procedure should be followed for fluid leaks between the radiator cooler and cooler line fittings.

Check the engine coolant in the radiator (8005). If transmission fluid is present in the coolant, the transmission fluid cooler (7A095) in the radiator is probably leaking.

The transmission fluid cooler can be further checked for leaks by disconnecting the lines from the cooler fittings and applying no more than 345 kPa (50 psi) air pressure to the fittings. Remove the radiator cap (8100) to relieve the pressure buildup at the exterior of the fluid cooler tank. If the transmission fluid cooler is leaking and/or will not hold pressure, replace the transmission fluid cooler.

If leakage is found at the manual control lever shaft (7C493), replace the seal.

When a converter drain plug leaks, remove the drain plug. Install new drain plug. Tighten to 24-27 Nm (18-20 lb-ft).

Check for fluid leaking from the end of extension housing (7A039). Leakage may result from damaged seal, missing garter spring or worn extension bushing or damaged speedometer plug. Replace seal assembly and/or bushing as necessary.

Inspect the plugs for leakage. Ensure they are tightened to 8-16 Nm (6-12 lb-ft). If tightening does not stop the leak, replace the plug.

Using the old fluid cooler tube as a guide, bend the new fluid cooler tube as required. Add the necessary fittings and install the fluid cooler tube.

After the fittings have been tightened, add fluid as needed and check for fluid leaks.


Fluid Leakage in Torque Converter Area
In diagnosing and correcting fluid leaks in the torque converter (7902) area, use the following procedures to locate the exact cause of the leakage. Leakage at the front of the transmission as evidenced by fluid around the converter housing, may have several sources. By careful observation it is possible, in many instances, to pinpoint the source of the leak before removing the transmission from the vehicle. The paths that the fluid can take to reach the bottom of the converter housing are as shown in the following illustration. The following five steps correspond with the numbers in the illustration.

Fluid leaking by the torque converter impeller hub seal lip will tend to move along the converter impeller hub and onto the back of the impeller housing. Except in the case of a total seal failure, fluid leakage by the lip of the seal will be deposited on the inside of the converter housing only, near the outside diameter of the converter housing.

Fluid leakage by the outside diameter of the converter hub seal and the case will follow the same path which the leaks by the inside diameter of the seal follow.

Fluid leakage from the torque converter to the flywheel stud weld, drain plug, or seal weld will appear at the outer diameter of the torque converter on the back face of the flywheel (6375), and in the converter housing only near theflywheel. If a converter leak is suspected, remove torque converter and pressure check. Refer to Torque Converter Checks under Disassembly/Reassembly of Subassemblies in the Disassembly portion of this section.

Fluid leakage from the pump will flow down the back of the converter housing. Leakage may be from loose or missing pump bolts, torn or damaged pump-to-case gasket and/or a worn pump bushing.

Engine oil leaks are sometimes improperly diagnosed as transmission pump seal leaks. The following areas of possible leakage should also be checked to determine if engine oil leakage is causing the problem.

Leakage at the valve cover may allow engine oil to flow over the converter housing or seep down between the converter housing and block causing oil to be present in or at the bottom of the converter housing.
Oil plug leaks will allow oil to flow down the rear face of the block to the converter housing.
Leakage at the crankshaft seal will work back to the flywheel, and then into the converter housing.

Leak Check Test
The following procedures should be used to determine the cause of the leakage before service is made.

Remove the fluid level indicator (7A020) and note the color of the fluid. Original factory fill fluid is dyed red to aid in determining if leakage is from the engine or transmission. Unless a considerable amount of makeup fluid has been added or the fluid has been changed, the red color should assist in pinpointing the leak.

Remove the converter housing cover. Clean off any fluid from the top and bottom of the converter housing, front of the transmission case, and rear face of the engine and pan. Clean the converter area by washing with suitable nonflammable solvent, and blow dry with compressed air.

Wash out converter housing and the front of the flywheel. The converter housing may be washed out using clean solvent and a squirt-type oil can. Blow all washed areas dry with compressed air.

Start and run the engine until the transmission reaches its normal operating temperature. Observe the back of the block and top of the converter housing for evidence of fluid leakage. Raise the vehicle on a hoist and position suitable safety stands under vehicle. Run the engine at fast idle, then at engine idle, occasionally shifting to the drive and reverse ranges to increase pressure within the transmission. Observe the front of the flywheel, back of the block (in as far as possible), and inside the converter housing and front of the transmission case. Run the engine until fluid leakage is evident and the probable source of leakage can be determined.

When a converter drain plug leaks, remove drain plug. Install new drain plug. Tighten to 24-27 Nm (18-20 lb-ft).


Leak Check Test with Black Light
Oil soluble aniline or fluorescent dyes premixed at the rate of 2.5ml (1/2 teaspoon) of dye powder to 0.24L (0.5 pint) of automatic transmission fluid have proven helpful in locating the source of fluid leakage. Such dyes may be used to determine whether an engine fluid or transmission fluid leak is present, or if the fluid in the transmission fluid cooler hose leaks into the engine coolant system. An ultraviolet light must be used to detect the fluorescent dye solution.

all from 1996 Bronco with E4OD Automatic Transmission Workshop Manual

more E4OD LINKs in my site @ http://www.broncolinks.com/index.php?index=63

such as;
Seal, Front Pump Replacement; "...My transmission is leaking fluid out the front, One of three conditions has likely happened. 1. The transmission too much fluid and was venting through the front pump 2. The transmission overheated and was venting fluid through the front pump 3. The front pump seal is bad. Replacing the front pump seal is not involved once the transmission is out. Simply remove the old seal and install the new one. Purchase the seal from Ford..."
Source: by Ian L (stangmata, stangmata50l, Bronco)
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my broncolinks.com was "disturbed"; but some sections are archived @ [url]http://web.archive.org/web/20121009110424/http://www.broncolinks.com/index.php
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Old 09-20-2011, 10:20 AM   #9
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Well...I installed a small trans cooler. I was going to get a big B&M cooler but this one was free so I figured I would give it a shot. I tapped to the line after the radiator so I was using both. I got it on Saturday night before a wheeling trip on Sunday. I was worried about the lines leaking where I hooked it up so I went to walmart that morning and bought 7 quarts of trans fluid just in case. Good thing I did. I got about 3/4 of a mile into the trail and I think the trans just overheated again...but it was a LOT worse this time. It was puking a lot of fluid and I eventually lost 4wd...I was trying to get over a medium sized berm and my back tires were spinning and the front was doing nothing. I'm glad this happened because Thats when I hopped out and noticed the flood of fluid coming out of the front of the trans. Oh...and it was on fire. Thanks headers. I put the fire out and we all stood around trying to figure out if it was a leak or over heating or what. I backed down the hill with the engine off and trans in neutral. Backing down a steep off road trail with no power brakes is a BITCH. I got back down to the next berm so I could check the fluid level and put more fluid in while it was closer to level. We decided to try to start it up and back it down the trail a little bit more to where I could turn around. I dumped some more fluid on the way down but it wasn't as bad as before. I got down to turn around, added 2 more quarts and we waited a while longer to cool it down. Then I drove out of the trail under my own power and 1.5 hours back home without another drop coming out.

Tell me if you guys think this might be accurate...

I think the trans overheated due to a lack of airflow over a cheap cooler. Do you think a B&M cooler will be enough to prevent this from happening again? Or will I need to add an electric fan as well? Do you think it could have been anything else? I would think that if it was a leak that serious, it would have continued and if there was a blockage in the line, the overheating would have happened WAY before I got to the trail.

Pic of where I parked it posed with the fire extinguisher...you can kinda see the fluid puddle here:



You can see the fluid puddle a lot better in this pic:

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Old 09-20-2011, 11:33 AM   #10
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It's easy to put a gauge on these, so I'd recommend that first so you can see what kinda temps you are dealing with. I do now run a derale electric fan that is a "puller" on the backside of my OEM tranny cooler. Strictly for trail use or slow going when you aren't getting any real air flow over your trannny cooler.
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Old 09-20-2011, 08:24 PM   #11
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It shouldnt be over heating if you were barely into the trial. I would check and make sure your tranny lines are not clogged. The easiest way to do this is risky. You can disconnect the return line at the transmission. While someone is under your truck have another person start the truck, you should see a steady stream of fluid come out of the return line. DO NOT run the truck for more than a few seconds, due to the obvious, that you will eventually pump all of the fluid out of your tranny.
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Old 09-20-2011, 08:45 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by fullsize95 View Post
It shouldnt be over heating if you were barely into the trial. I would check and make sure your tranny lines are not clogged. The easiest way to do this is risky. You can disconnect the return line at the transmission. While someone is under your truck have another person start the truck, you should see a steady stream of fluid come out of the return line. DO NOT run the truck for more than a few seconds, due to the obvious, that you will eventually pump all of the fluid out of your tranny.
I agree...however...see my previous post...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Big RIck View Post
...and if there was a blockage in the line, the overheating would have happened WAY before I got to the trail.
I had to drive an hour and a half to get to the trail on windy back roads. Don't you think that the overheating and overflowing would have happened well before I got to the trail if there was a blockage and no flow? I also checked when I hooked up the cooler because I wanted to see which line the fluid came from so I could hook up the cooler accordingly. I know fluid got through the radiator and to the cooler.

I ordered a Long LPD4590 cooler to replace the one I have now. Hopefully that'll help.
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Old 09-20-2011, 08:54 PM   #13
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Another option is your vent tube could be clogged. Its located on top of the transmission, disconnect it and blow through the tube. I had a truck that dirt dobbers had built a nest in my vent tube, I found out it was there when I went to check the fluid one day. When I pulled the dip stick fluid shot about two feet in the air. So the pressure has to go somewhere, and your front pump seal might be the weak link. This could be an indication that the seal is going bad as well. You have to pull the tranny to replace it.
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Old 09-20-2011, 10:51 PM   #14
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ok...where does the vent tube go? I thought it was just a vent in the top...didn't know there was a tube.

Another thing that I forgot to mention before. I was in 4Lo and manually in 1st gear. I don't know if that would matter...but I thought I'd add it in just in case it might turn a light bulb in someone's head.
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Old 09-20-2011, 11:16 PM   #15
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Mine has done this twice, the trans overheats and it blows the front pump seal out, causing it to leak... once it cools off, it reseals and its fine...

If you ever have to replace it, the seal for the 4R100 is better, so replace it with that....
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Old 09-21-2011, 08:31 PM   #16
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i overheated my trans at the local mud bogs and it was in the dead of summer here in florida. I was doing alot of slow driving around and occasional drive through the mud, then all a sudden i lost ALL of my fluid, so i decided to leave and try to make it to the walmart which was about 15 miles away, after smoking up the highway because of a overheated trans i got half way until the tranny just gave up on me from having noooo fluid in it, so i pulled over, had my mom lol come get me so i could go get some tranny fluid, i put about 10 quarts in it before it would grab a gear again, then eventually topped it off. all of this happened about 10 months ago and to this day the tranny works just fine, doesnt slip or anything. I wonder if i should change the filter and fluid after that happening?????
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Old 09-21-2011, 09:27 PM   #17
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Im not sure if the e40d has an extended vent tube or not, the transmission I had was a 4l80e. The vent is located on top of the tranny, almost dead center. It can easily be accessed through the removable panel in front of your center console on the floor. You have to pull back the carpet to access the panel though.
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Old 09-21-2011, 10:00 PM   #18
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i overheated my trans at the local mud bogs and it was in the dead of summer here in florida. I was doing alot of slow driving around and occasional drive through the mud, then all a sudden i lost ALL of my fluid, so i decided to leave and try to make it to the walmart which was about 15 miles away, after smoking up the highway because of a overheated trans i got half way until the tranny just gave up on me from having noooo fluid in it, so i pulled over, had my mom lol come get me so i could go get some tranny fluid, i put about 10 quarts in it before it would grab a gear again, then eventually topped it off. all of this happened about 10 months ago and to this day the tranny works just fine, doesnt slip or anything. I wonder if i should change the filter and fluid after that happening?????
Depending on what year truck you had, you should not have done this (really ANY auto can't take heat, it destroys it). An E4OD however is a lot of money to rebuild, and while it certainly would be a good idea to drop the pan, clean the magnet, put new filter and fluid in, you are lucky it still works. However, you are probably unlucky since it shortented the overall life by many many miles. I wouldn't trust it going forward, and would be surprised if it made it very long at all without more issues.
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Old 09-21-2011, 10:04 PM   #19
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Im not sure if the e40d has an extended vent tube or not, the transmission I had was a 4l80e. The vent is located on top of the tranny, almost dead center. It can easily be accessed through the removable panel in front of your center console on the floor. You have to pull back the carpet to access the panel though.
It's the same as far as getting to it, but it's not extended, it's just sitting there. And as I recall it has a little breather "hat" on it, which I had to remove I think in order to put a rubber extended line on it, ran up into the engire compartment with all the other breathers.
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Old 09-21-2011, 10:19 PM   #20
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A temp gauge and a cooler worked on both mine. I also eliminated my radiator cooler and added an external filter kit ($30 at advance). I love that picture! :)
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