Catastrophic failure - Page 2 - Ford Bronco Forum
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post #21 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-15-2019, 08:14 AM
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I'm looking forward to it, I love engine porn; just don't like the cost that goes along with a catastrophic failure. We have all gone through it at some point and time. (trust me, I've had my share of 'em)

Curious to see if you find the cause of the failure. It would suck to start all over again and not know why.

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post #22 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-15-2019, 10:16 AM Thread Starter
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I'm looking forward to it, I love engine porn; just don't like the cost that goes along with a catastrophic failure. We have all gone through it at some point and time. (trust me, I've had my share of 'em)

Curious to see if you find the cause of the failure. It would suck to start all over again and not know why.
I've been speculating the cause ever since it happened. I guess you could say that I was initially being optimistic that the heads might be good and I could swap them to a good short block. Seeing that much metal in the valley has me doubting that though.

It might take me a bit to get everything apart. I don't have room to work on this thing, so I'm stripping it in the bed of my truck. I guess once I get the bulk of it off I can assemble my hoist (buried in my back room) and try to flip the block over and back onto that tire so I can disassemble the bottom end.

And to answer your question on the valve springs. The short answer is I don't know.

I do know that the builder changed springs on the dyno to a stiffer spring than was originally used due to a valve float problem on the initial pull. There's a lot I could say about that particular machine shop, specifically the owner, but I won't, because it'd take all day and make for one really long post.
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post #23 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-15-2019, 11:18 AM
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... There's a lot I could say about that particular machine shop, specifically the owner, but I won't, because it'd take all day and make for one really long post.
In that case, maybe I'll pour a glass of "Scotch" that'll get me through a long story, or at least a couple of hours of it.

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post #24 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-15-2019, 12:02 PM
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I have seen pushrods wrapped around the camshaft and crank before, usually too much rpm does that.
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post #25 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 10:23 PM
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In high school I was in my junkyard salvaged ‘69 Torino Cobra racing a guy with a very pretty original Boss 302 Mustang. I won, and a couple weeks later his cam broke and a chunk of it got knocked through the block. A sad day.

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post #26 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-16-2019, 11:55 PM Thread Starter
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Also, supposedly Comp Cams had a bad bunch of cams for these motors, or at least so I am told.
Also forgot to say, I'm impressed you knew it was a comp cam just by looking at this mess. Do they have very specific lifters or something else that gave it away?

If my memory serves me, this is the cam that they put in. I distinctly remember the 262 and the fact it was a 4x4 cam.

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post #27 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 06:06 AM
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Lol, no way to tell, just a random statement about comp cams; I remember guys complaining that there was a batch of soft or flawed cams .
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post #28 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 06:27 AM Thread Starter
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One of the things that the owner of that machine shop told me that pissed me off at the time was after he was done running it through the various rpm while breaking it in when he shut it down before making any pulls for tuning. He tells me "Now's the moment of truth.". I'm like "what are you talking about?". That's when he explains to me (did I mention I was really green back then?) that he has an inline filter on the dyno that he's gonna open up. If it's all gray then it means the cam wiped out and I basically paid him several grand for nothing. I'm like wtf are you talking about. He said that comp cams won't warranty an engine failure caused by one of their cams, so why should he? That's some crap I would have liked to have known before I committed to annnnnything with that place.

Fortunately the cam didn't wipe... or explode until yours truly did what you're seeing here.


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post #29 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 08:07 AM
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post #30 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 10:00 AM Thread Starter
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Ok guys. I got off work about an hour ago and I have an itchy trigger finger. I'm gonna go get the impact and pull a head before I crash for a few hours.

Which one ya'll want me to pull? Passenger side or driver side? Let's make this an interactive tear down. Lol
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post #31 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 12:33 PM
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One of the things that the owner of that machine shop told me that pissed me off at the time was after he was done running it through the various rpm while breaking it in when he shut it down before making any pulls for tuning. He tells me "Now's the moment of truth.". I'm like "what are you talking about?". That's when he explains to me (did I mention I was really green back then?) that he has an inline filter on the dyno that he's gonna open up. If it's all gray then it means the cam wiped out and I basically paid him several grand for nothing. I'm like wtf are you talking about. He said that comp cams won't warranty an engine failure caused by one of their cams, so why should he? That's some crap I would have liked to have known before I committed to annnnnything with that place.

Fortunately the cam didn't wipe... or explode until yours truly did what you're seeing here.
Not having to worry about cam breakin is worth every penny of upgrading or using an existing roller cam setup. I always hated going through everything 5 or 6 times before first fire up. Because it's not like you could fire it up for the first time - see a coolant leak - shut it back off then try again. That was asking for a cam to wipe. I remember a small block chevy running lean as all get out on first fire up. Before we were done breaking the cam in, I swear the headers were GLOWING hot.

Another benefit to EFI over carb most of the time....

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post #32 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 01:16 PM Thread Starter
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Well since I got no takers on a head side I decided to start on the passenger side. I got far enough into things where I figured I may as well keep going as I wasn't very tired even after being up since 4:30pm yesterday and I've almost got the driver side head off as well.

I've hit a snag though. The head bolts between the rockers on the passenger side had enough space on each side that I could get my impact onto them and buzz them off. I'm unable to do that on the driver side. I can only get the two bolts on either end and the others down the middle don't have enough room. That's with the rockers off and out of the way.

I believe these are called pushrod guide plates. I'm not 100% on everything engine related, but I'm pretty sure that's what these are. They are blocking the head bolts a bit and the rocker studs are holding them on. As you can see I can't just put a deep socket over the rocker studs and buzz them off with the impact as there's no bolt head on them. What's the best way to get this style of stud off?


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post #33 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 03:38 PM
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When you don't have a stud extractor, double nut'em.

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post #34 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 07:00 PM
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Yep, spin a nut on, then jam another nut up against the first one. Put the wrench on the first nut you put on and loosen.

Or bust out the cutoff wheel... unless you plan on reusing the heads.

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post #35 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 11:47 AM Thread Starter
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When you don't have a stud extractor, double nut'em.
I wasn't sure if a double nut would work, but I'll give that a try. One of the videos I looked up later showed a guy using a stud remover and the pressed in studs he had looked like they had no threads on the side that was in the head. I'm not sure what kind they used on these, but I guess I'll find out. Fortunately I have a True Value that's a couple blocks from me. I almost always forget they exist, because they're tucked away in an unfrequented part of town. Home Depot and Lowes are way on the other side of town along with Tacoma Screw. Its funny putting that into perspective though. The other side of town for me is like 3 miles. Sounds kinda dumb thinking about it that way.


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Yep, spin a nut on, then jam another nut up against the first one. Put the wrench on the first nut you put on and loosen.

Or bust out the cutoff wheel... unless you plan on reusing the heads.
I'm gonna try to avoid doing any damage to the heads at this point. If the heads are good I'll reuse them or sell them with the roller rockers on them. So far the passenger side looks good, but I'm no pro or machinist, so they could be bad upon closer inspection. Nothing looks obviously bent and no holes that don't look like they belong. It definitely needs some cleaning. If the driver side head is bad then I don't know what's gonna happen.


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post #36 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 11:52 AM Thread Starter
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Having a cordless impact makes things super easy. I'd hate doing this without it.





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post #37 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 11:56 AM
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If they are press in studs, you'll have to get creative with nuts, a socket, a piece of metal with 3 holes in a line and two bolts. Place a strip of metal with 3 holes in it on the stud, with it poking through the center hole. Then use a nut to keep it from coming off. Then place two bolts through either end hole and put a nut on the under side. Holding those bottom nuts, turn the bolts inwards to "Jack up" the flat metal strip. This will put pressure on the stud nut and eventually pull it out.
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post #38 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 12:18 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by BigBlue 94 View Post
If they are press in studs, you'll have to get creative with nuts, a socket, a piece of metal with 3 holes in a line and two bolts. Place a strip of metal with 3 holes in it on the stud, with it poking through the center hole. Then use a nut to keep it from coming off. Then place two bolts through either end hole and put a nut on the under side. Holding those bottom nuts, turn the bolts inwards to "Jack up" the flat metal strip. This will put pressure on the stud nut and eventually pull it out.
Do you think I could use a steering wheel puller in a similar fashion? I have one of those lying around somewhere.
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post #39 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 12:23 PM
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Subscribed, this should be an interesting thread to follow
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post #40 of 138 (permalink) Old 06-18-2019, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by BigBlue 94 View Post
If they are press in studs, you'll have to get creative with nuts, a socket, a piece of metal with 3 holes in a line and two bolts. Place a strip of metal with 3 holes in it on the stud, with it poking through the center hole. Then use a nut to keep it from coming off. Then place two bolts through either end hole and put a nut on the under side. Holding those bottom nuts, turn the bolts inwards to "Jack up" the flat metal strip. This will put pressure on the stud nut and eventually pull it out.
If you had a thick enough piece of metal, I'd think you could tap the holes for your bolts. That'd prevent the need for a backup wrench.
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