[jimtmcdaniels]

HI, just sharing for anyone looking to do what I did.

Coyles 9-1138 Timing chain kit for my 1996 E350 Club Wagon 351w. Leaking coolant from my timing chain cover. So I replaced the water pump as well and the gaskets for the cover behind it.
But noticed the oem timing chain with 115k miles had some stretch/slack. So I decided to replace with this superior affordable chain gear set. Why foolishly wait till the oem chain breaks when it gets somewhere over 200k miles?

This set's gear allows an optional advance key setting of 8 deg which advances the cam 4 deg. I live at 6k altitude, thinner air.
I choose this optional setting and so far am happy I did. It sounds the same.
This change increased the cranking compression on the cylinder I tested before and after, by 28psi! and now the engine has more torque and perhaps better mpg. I pull a 3,200 lbs boat in the summer.
Making a right turn from a dead stop, flooring it, I can scratch/spin the rear tire some where before I could not.
I can't say about the gas mileage because my gas tank had a leak..

Now intake valve closes slightly sooner for the compression stroke to start sooner, more in line with pre emissions engines of the late 1960's. In the 70's and up, they retarded the timing for emission reasons. Many online suggest this change for all round improvement.
Many after market cams have this increase built in and one way they improve the engine performance.

Engine sounds and drives the same but has more torque when starting from a stop. The advance should also shift the peak power curve sooner (say like 400 rpm's) in the rpm's but I can't tell the difference. Still accelerates with power all the way through red lines up just fine when flooring the gas pedal.
I believe I'd still pass an emissions test if we still had one here.

Some more expensive like racing kits allow even more timing advance settings and some say to advance until the cranking compression peaks for best setting results. However that may not result in much more advance. I mean, I may be about to the sweet spot now. Also advancing more could cause engine knocking which would require retarding the timing or high octane gas. It would be interesting to play around with it more like that but I just wanted it simple.

Mark all your bolts for their positions, the bolt ends and their related holes! I used different colored paint pens from ebay. Take some pictures as you go as well, for reassembly. Take your time.

ANY bolts that are stuck, DON"T force them, they may BREAK. Instead, spray with wd-40 and let um soak. THEN move the bolt just slightly tighter then just loose, then repeat back and forth. This can break and fracture the crud and rust slowly away. Eventually you should be able to get more and more back and forth movement til patiently you can unscrew all the way.
Otherwise applying torch heat can unfreeze any corroded or rusted bolts.

You do have to reset our ignition timing anytime you replace the chain changes the setting since the old chain had slack.
Watch youtube videos and never hammer any of it, especially the cam shaft. Only use a rubber mallet instead at most and lots of wiggling and use pry tools as needed, to move tight gears and chain things into position.

Use black gasket maker rubbed on both sides of the new gaskets and some beads in the corners of the cover where it mates to the oil pan, for leak free sealing. Also assure the timing cover's crank shaft round seal is centered with the dampener shaft hub, slightly test installed to assure that round seal is even(timing cover position) and will not leak.

Any sharing what they know about this would be cool, share your experience or knowledge.

 

[miesk5]

Yo Jim,
Welcome and thanks!

 

[BigBlue 94]

Advancing a cam 4° is popular for the 300-6 crowd. It effectively changes the dynamic compression ratio due to the valve events happening sooner. This also leaves more exhaust gases in the chamber, so a well-scavenging exhaust will also be of benefit.

It can cause detonation issues though, so listen closely.

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

Advancing a cam 4° is popular for the 300-6 crowd. It effectively changes the dynamic compression ratio due to the valve events happening sooner. This also leaves more exhaust gases in the chamber, so a well-scavenging exhaust will also be of benefit.

It can cause detonation issues though, so listen closely.

Thank you very much Big Blue for sharing the info I didn’t know!
My 96 351w OBD1 stock roller cam does Not have a knock sensor from what I could find out so I have been listening carefully. I even drove a bit with the dog house open a bit so I could listen for knocking under different conditions and heavy throttle and on hills.

*Q. What mpg changes do the 300 ci 6 cylinder crowd experience, do you know?

My van is pretty much stock is what I go for with minor common sense win-win mods only.

I want to post some questions about possible adding short headers if I can find a maker for them.
Other than that, I don’t think there’s anything else I can simply easily affordable do to increase engine performance or mpg.

Better scavenging eh.. to create like a pulsing vacuum in the exhaust to help pull in the intake gasses.
From what I’ve read, seems the factory exhaust and manifolds are designed to scavenge..
Maybe shorties would improve things as well.
My 96 factory exhaust seems to be different or better than some of the earlier ones in that it is a dual exhaust all the way to behind the rear pass tire it exists.
But it has one cat and muffler but two pipes going in and out of them..
So it seems to me the only bottleneck of real concern may be the factory exhaust manifold.

*2nd Q. Can you shed any light/info on this?
Thank you

 

[Kingfish999]

on a stock engine doing a timing chain i usually advance the cam 2-4*

general rule of thumb is advance the cam helps low end torque and retarding the cam give high end HP.

not to mention IIRC the stock cam is retarted like 4* or some like that anyways. adding slack doesnt help either

there was an Engine Master episode that went into dyno testing different cam timing settings as well as explaining some of it.

the real point of having all those timing setting is when 'degreeing a cam' you can get the cam timing correct

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

on a stock engine doing a timing chain i usually advance the cam 2-4*

general rule of thumb is advance the cam helps low end torque and retarding the cam give high end HP.

not to mention IIRC the stock cam is retarted like 4* or some like that anyways. adding slack doesnt help either

there was an Engine Master episode that went into dyno testing different cam timing settings as well as explaining some of it.

the real point of having all those timing setting is when 'degreeing a cam' you can get the cam timing correct

Cool thanks Kingfish!

I know I’ve read that advancing moves the torque and hp peaks to a lower rpm.
I believe it’s about 300 rpm move down for the peaks for a 4 cam degrees advance.
I guess as long as when you redline the engine on full throttle, it’ll still accelerate up to the next gear shift rpm and shift, then that’s fine.

Well so when you do a water pump, do you often go deeper and do the cam sprocket advance at that time?

Any experience on changes in mpg with advancing?

With advancing the cam timing, increases the compression ratio since the intake valves close sooner.
We all know that higher compression engines have more power and mpg but going too high requires pricey high octane gas.
High compression is quite a bit why our Diesel engines get more torque and mpg as well as Mazda’s new Mazda gas engine-forget what it’s called.. oh I think it’s Sky X… or

When emission standards hit in like 1972 and they retarded the crank sprocket timing to reduce pollution, I wonder which pollution it reduces.. HC or CO or Nit oxide … hmm

 

[Kingfish999]

i do a timing chain any time i do water pump because sometimes the timing covers leak due to replacing the water pump. plus added performance. only time i dont is when chain is been done before

i dont really pay attention to mpg because i have a lead foot. and i tend to go through engines faster than timing chain can wear.

the dynamic compression will be slightly higher due to the valve closing. static compression will always be low on a stock engine around like ~8.5:1. so theres no real issue to needing premium fuel due to it. but on high compression engines you can use the valve timing to help bleed off some of the compression if needed. my 408 engine has 10.5:1 static and my cam makes it have about dynamic compression around 8.5:1

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

i do a timing chain any time i do water pump because sometimes the timing covers leak due to replacing the water pump. plus added performance. only time i dont is when chain is been done before

i dont really pay attention to mpg because i have a lead foot. and i tend to go through engines faster than timing chain can wear.

the dynamic compression will be slightly higher due to the valve closing. static compression will always be low on a stock engine around like ~8.5:1. so theres no real issue to needing premium fuel due to it. but on high compression engines you can use the valve timing to help bleed off some of the compression if needed. my 408 engine has 10.5:1 static and my cam makes it have about dynamic compression around 8.5:1

Seems pretty wise.

I’ve previously read discussions of original poster asking for any methods to easily improve engine performance or more towing torque.
Many advice is given, including telling the original poster that nothing can easily be done. I’ve never seen the fairly simple advancing the cam with a timing chain kit discussed or mentioned, it’s simply overlooked by many.

Oh ok so you’ve retarded the cam timing so that you can run regular gas on a high compression engine so you don’t have to pay for pricey premium?
But couldn’t you possibly remove the need for premium by regarding the ignition timing?
I think it’s said that on some of the newest high compression engines will reduce the ignition timing if you fill it with regular instead of premium so it’ll take it. I guess it’s just the knock sensor system.

 

[BigBlue 94]

Dynamic compression is what determines octane usage, not static. But with a static of only 8.5, dynamic will never be high enough likely to affect anything.

I have seen an econoline with shorty headers. Had a pic but cant find it. I think they were hedman brand. The idea of scavenging is to use the other cylinder pulses to draw the last bits of exhaust out of a cylinder. Intake valves open before the piston has forced all the exhaust out, causing the need for scavenging. The opposite is called reversion, and is more common with exhaust manifolds as opposed to headers since the manifolds are essentially a plenum.

 

[BigBlue 94]

Most guys in the 300 crowd do the advance for power, not milage. But with power, comes increased milage, if driven with economy in mind.

Didnt read close enough to see you have a 96 351w with SD/OBD1 like me. I have a 96 F350 with one. Im running summit shorty headers, a custom 2.25 into 3" y-pipe with oxygen sensor, and a flowmaster deltaflow 50 series muffler. Upon doing the exhaust, and reintroducing the oxygen sensor to the mix, i picked up 2mpg and a bit of power. Thats with 33" tires, 4.10 gears, and a C6. I left the EGR hooked up as well, but the rest of the smog system is gone.

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

Dynamic compression is what determines octane usage, not static. But with a static of only 8.5, dynamic will never be high enough likely to affect anything.

I have seen an econoline with shorty headers. Had a pic but cant find it. I think they were hedman brand. The idea of scavenging is to use the other cylinder pulses to draw the last bits of exhaust out of a cylinder. Intake valves open before the piston has forced all the exhaust out, causing the need for scavenging. The opposite is called reversion, and is more common with exhaust manifolds as opposed to headers since the manifolds are essentially a plenum.

Thank you for the explanation!
I’ve read a good number of discussions on headers and many contradicting others about the usefulness of shorties for towing.

 

[BigBlue 94]

Thank you for the explanation!
I’ve read a good number of discussions on headers and many contradicting others about the usefulness of shorties for towing.

The ONLY thing manifolds do better than shorty or long tube headers is hold in heat. Your doghouse will get warmer with the headers, but not by much. The headers in a van will have better airflow under them for cooling than in a pickup since the van engine sits lower in the frame.

Much of what you will find on the internet about headers is wrong. Most will say longtube headers are only good for high rpm. This is not true. Longtubes will outperform a shorty and especially a manifold at any point in the rpm range. Shorties will give a slight increase over manifolds, especially if they are equal length shorties.

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

Most guys in the 300 crowd do the advance for power, not milage. But with power, comes increased milage, if driven with economy in mind.

Didnt read close enough to see you have a 96 351w with SD/OBD1 like me. I have a 96 F350 with one. Im running summit shorty headers, a custom 2.25 into 3" y-pipe with oxygen sensor, and a flowmaster deltaflow 50 series muffler. Upon doing the exhaust, and reintroducing the oxygen sensor to the mix, i picked up 2mpg and a bit of power. Thats with 33" tires, 4.10 gears, and a C6. I left the EGR hooked up as well, but the rest of the smog system is gone.

Oh wow you have the same year and engine that’s very helpful!
I thought I was getting the obd2 since it was a 96 and had the obd2 port under the dash. But since the gvw was over the 9k or whatever the cut off for the obd2 requirement was, it’s an obd1 hybrid.

You say Sd/obd1? What is the sd part stand for?

Wow that’s a great mpg pickup!

Unlike you, I do still have the OEM smog pump.. when it breaks, I probably won’t replace it.
I did see a YouTube video on how to delete it. I’ll probably do that since I don’t need a second alternator set up.

interesting you have the C6 transmission. I thought they all used the 4AOD like mine has.

Please tell me on the headers:
How is the heat a problem? Did you get them ceramic coated or wrapped?
This could be a problem for the van doghouse!
I know one of the clamp rivets by the gas pedal on my dog house gets hot to the touch of I’m not wearing socks.

Also how did the headers effect the exhaust sound and sound level?

Listings don’t usually show a header for the van but they do for the trucks with the same year and engine..perhaps because of the dog house not taking the heat.

I think I previously only found one shorty header that says it’ll fit. I have to relook.

 

[BigBlue 94]

Found the pic!

Yes, somewhere around 9k was the weight cutoff for OBD1 exemption in 96. SD is speed density, as opposed to MAF.

Whats funny is I had bought my truck and was driving home and noticed no overdrive symbol on the gear selector. Figured it too was an E4OD. C6 was a special order item through 96. My truck was originally a snow plow truck for KC, Missouri.

I have longtubes on the 300 in my bronco. JetHot coating did nothing to help with the extreme heat they were putting off. Now they have exhaust wrap on them which helps a good bit. The only time i ever had a problem with the heat is going real slow offroad.

Shorty headers will add a slight echo to the exhaust note, and maybe a couple dB, but not too much louder. I would think truck headers would fit, certainly with a matching new y-pipe.

 

[Stevo440]

@jimtmcdaniels, you said: "Wow that’s a great mpg pickup!" Remember now that @BigBlue 94 said: "Upon doing the exhaust, and reintroducing the oxygen sensor to the mix, i picked up 2mpg and a bit of power." Most if not all the MPG gains comes from the using of the O2 sensor(s) unless the original Exhaust system was overly Restrictive/Clogged. Just some FYI to thinkabout.

 

[BigBlue 94]

"Wow that’s a great mpg pickup!" Remember now that @BigBlue 94 said: "Upon doing the exhaust, and reintroducing the oxygen sensor to the mix, i picked up 2mpg and a bit of power." Most if not all the MPG gains comes from the using of the O2 sensor(s) unless the original Exhaust system was overly Restrictive/Clogged. Just some FYI to thinkabout.

Yes, the key to that was the reintroduction of an oxygen sensor to the mix. It had already been de-catted so the old exhaust, besides the hack job done on it, was not really restrictive. At least 1.5 of those 2 mpgs were from the O2 sensor alone.

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

@jimtmcdaniels, you said: "Wow that’s a great mpg pickup!" Remember now that @BigBlue 94 said: "Upon doing the exhaust, and reintroducing the oxygen sensor to the mix, i picked up 2mpg and a bit of power." Most if not all the MPG gains comes from the using of the O2 sensor(s) unless the original Exhaust system was overly Restrictive/Clogged. Just some FYI to thinkabout.

For my oem dual exhaust seems the only bottleneck would be the exhaust manifolds..and the smog pump..

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

Found the pic!

Yes, somewhere around 9k was the weight cutoff for OBD1 exemption in 96. SD is speed density, as opposed to MAF.

Whats funny is I had bought my truck and was driving home and noticed no overdrive symbol on the gear selector. Figured it too was an E4OD. C6 was a special order item through 96. My truck was originally a snow plow truck for KC, Missouri.

I have longtubes on the 300 in my bronco. JetHot coating did nothing to help with the extreme heat they were putting off. Now they have exhaust wrap on them which helps a good bit. The only time i ever had a problem with the heat is going real slow offroad.

Shorty headers will add a slight echo to the exhaust note, and maybe a couple dB, but not too much louder. I would think truck headers would fit, certainly with a matching new y-pipe.

I don’t want to get over my head of my abilities and experience, changing the Y pipe.
Hoping to find an easy shorty header plug n play.. if it exists

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

I don’t want to get over my head of my abilities and experience, changing the Y pipe.
Hoping to find an easy shorty header plug n play.. if it exists

The change in sound seems fine then.
This oem exhaust already has a truck rumble.
I added some steep cables and Barb wire to the cat to reduce chance of theft.
I’ve read mine is popular to steal and expensive to replace.

 

[jimtmcdaniels]

The ONLY thing manifolds do better than shorty or long tube headers is hold in heat. Your doghouse will get warmer with the headers, but not by much. The headers in a van will have better airflow under them for cooling than in a pickup since the van engine sits lower in the frame.

Much of what you will find on the internet about headers is wrong. Most will say longtube headers are only good for high rpm. This is not true. Longtubes will outperform a shorty and especially a manifold at any point in the rpm range. Shorties will give a slight increase over manifolds, especially if they are equal length shorties.

I can’t imagine putting equal length shorties I’ve seen look like a headache.

The wrap seems a bit like a headache as well, but it seems the ceramic coating doesn’t cut the heat very well.
I haven’t seen a side by side heat reduction comparison. I should try to look for one out there, scientific evidence on it