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Discussion Starter #1
well im new to the site i joined hoping to get some advice, i have a 78 with the 351 m in it its got a 4 bbl and dyno max headers the rest is stock, i am in iraq right now and i have a 6.5 in super lift and a saw zall waitin to put on it when i get home i plan to run 40'' but i think the 351 will be just a bit weak, i was wondering should i just build it to a mild 400 or should i get the 460 for it, i want around 350 hp 375 ft lbs any help would be nice
 

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You are gonna hear strong advocates for each.

A 400 can do those numbers easy.

Many more performance parts available for a 460.

If you do a 460 use the NCSpecialties engine perches.

I have a strong 400 in mine.

For 400 parts go direct to T Meyer.
 

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The power you want is within easy reach of the motor you have, so 400 would be the practical choice. Welcome and thanks for doing your part overseas.
 

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I had a 400 with a mild cam/Intake/heavy duty valve springs/hedders/and 4 bbl, and the thing ran great and had awesome power. Then my brother ran it out of oil and blew it up. So I dropped in a 460 with basically the same mods, and it really was not much of an improvement. But, now I have an Injected 460 from an 89 1 Ton and LOVE it.

So, basically With the power range your looking at, I would stick with the 400... Unless you can score a fuel injected 460 with 10,000 miles for $500.00 like me :thumbup
 

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Search, and you will find lots on this subject.

Horsepower TV just did a build on a 460 to see just how well a mild 460 can run on a budget. They spent $2300 total and got:
493 lb-ft Torque at 3400 rpm
378 hp at 4700 rpm

Classic Trucks did a comparable build on a 400. However they had to adapt some 351C slugs and have the rotating assembly balanced (400 has only one vendor making performance pistons):
429 lb ft Torque
301 hp

$ for horse power, your money will go a heck of a lot further in a 460 than it will in an M-block.
 

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if you have a 460 then go with the 460. There are so many more performance parts for it, the 460 just has so much more potential, it can be bored out so much more and there is just no substitute forcubic inches. I have a 71 lincoln 460 bored .030 over and am more than happy with the power the motor has, if you dump the same amount of dollars in a 400 I can't imagine it could keep up. The only downfall is the amount of parts and effort that goes in to the initial installation of the 460. You have to get a bigger radiator, different mounts, brackets and sometimes you need to rig up a throttle linkage because the stock linkage sometimes is too short, mine was just right but there was a recent thread from someone who wasn't so lucky. Good luck.
 

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454, thank you and have a nice day
 

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The biggest cost in going to the 460 is exhaust work. Motor mounts are around 100 bucks. The stock 351/400 PS bracket can be made to work. My 429 is cooled by an OE 3 core. The only time it gets too warm, is when the air temp is around 90.


the only advantage I can see to a 400, is less weight. Putting aluminum heads on a 460, almost negates that advantage. 4" lift springs, under a 460 will net you about 3 inches.
 

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Putting alum heads on a 400 negates that advantage.
 

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I much prefer the M block to the 460.

It's lighter, cheaper to work on, and (IME) is a hardier engine. The only big disadvantage to it is the lack of an easy EFI system, but it can be done.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
thanks for all the info guys, i think im gonna keep the m block, i just seem to have problems finding a good site to order the stuff i want, now im just looking for a good complete cam kit and the 400 crank and pistons, but should i go ahead and have it bored .30 over or just get the bores checked out
 

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You might be able to use some Cleveland parts on the M, they're the same family of course. They're nto super plentiful either, but there is a growing aftermarket for Cleveland parts. Not so much for the M or 400. My 2 cents is go to the 460, there is not much involved in the swap and the potential is unlimited as others have mentioned.
 

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thanks for all the info guys, i think im gonna keep the m block, i just seem to have problems finding a good site to order the stuff i want, now im just looking for a good complete cam kit and the 400 crank and pistons, but should i go ahead and have it bored .30 over or just get the bores checked out

Seems the M Blocks like the DEH-255 or my preference, the XE-262 cams from Comp. I believe the complete kit is under $400. You should be able to get it from Summit. As for the cylinders...may as well go .030 over while you're in there. Figure most shops charge $30 a cylinder, so unless you're tight for money, I'd do it. The rotating assembly should be gotten through Tim Meyer Inc...he's the guy to see when it comes to these engines.

http://www.tmeyerinc.com/400Fordpg1.htm






BTW...I'm a huge fan of the M blocks as well. So the 400 gets my vote. For reference, when fully dressed, the 400 is 75-100lbs lighter than a 460. And a misconception when comparing a 400 to a 460 is any 460 will dominate a 400. Not so true, most guys aren't comparing smogged engines to smogged engines, they're comparing early unsmogged 429/460's to the smogged up 400. Which really isn't a fair/good comparison. When comparing apples to apples, in stock form, the 400 has right around 90% of the hp and 90% of the tq that a 460 does, but the 400 brings it down in a more useable rpm range. All this info is on Bubba's M-Block page...but I can't seem to access the archived site.
 

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thanks for all the info guys, i think im gonna keep the m block, i just seem to have problems finding a good site to order the stuff i want, now im just looking for a good complete cam kit and the 400 crank and pistons, but should i go ahead and have it bored .30 over or just get the bores checked out
400 will probably work fine. Just heed the following:

Do not go bigger than 0.030" over bore. The cylinder liners are thin.

Do the oiling system mod to allow more oil to the mains. These engines are hell on bearings.

Magnaflux the crap out of the block. Even the D7TE blocks are prone to cracking

Good luck....you just might need it.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
yeah Tim Meyer Inc it a great site one of the only ones i can find on the m series, and im tryin to hit some where in the ball park of 1200 for the parts not counting the machine shop cost, the next problem i have is my garage wont be tall enoulf to build it in, looks like im gonna be outside, the last time i pulled the motor to clean it up and put new seals in it and the trans i was in the dirt and most of the time at night, so this should be an upgrade, plus with the lift it wont be so hard to get under, and a lil side note i had a hell of a time telling my buddies that ford wasnt cast by big and small block per say that they were cast in series, but i think i made them belivers
 

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... and a lil side note i had a hell of a time telling my buddies that ford wasnt cast by big and small block per say that they were cast in series, but i think i made them belivers
Mopar was the same way in the 60's and 70's. There were small blocks, polyhead, B, RB, and (bow before the) Hemi.
 

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