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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey together,

now I'm going forward...while I have had some oil-wet outlet on the exhaust mainfold, I'm going to remove the cylinder heads...while removing the intake mainfold, I have found this:
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Is this something "normal"? I know, this cars has run about some 100.000 miles and above...but the deposits are about 1/2 of an inch...so I'm going to clean this mess up and remove the heads next week.
Have you seen such a dirt of oil and soot annyway? Is this normal or is this caused by "un-normal" conditions?

Thanks for your reply...
 

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1992 Ford Bronco XLT 5.0 E40D, 2 spacers and lunch box up front, 32 in chanclas
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Excessive sludge in the engine can be from lack of oil changes, worn out engine. I’ve had friends that have seen cars that never had an oil change since new and the engine looked like that. Compression check that thing before you pull them heads off. That is definitely not normal. If compression is good, didn’t burn excessive oil, no shavings in the pan, good oil pressure. Clean it up slap it back together and run it till it dies. I wouldn’t recommend running anything in the motor that will clean that stuff such as kerosene, atf, or any of those products that clean the inside of the motor after a head gasket failure. That stuff falling to the oil pan and covering up that pickup tube is no bueno. After you clean the valley I suggest you remove the oil pan to clean it. May be a pain in the ass but if the engine is solid it’s worth it and cheaper than a replacement. In my used motor I bought there was a lot of deposits from lack of maintenance. But nothing like that.
 

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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
OK, thanks for that!
Yeah, my plan to continue was nearly as you mentioned:
  • removing the heads and clean them up
  • check the cylinders, pistons and the rings
  • remove and clean the oil-pan
  • check the connecting rod and crankshaft bearings

I thought this mess may have to do with the exhaust gas recirculation...but it doesn't seems so, if I follow your experience.

The Bronco runs good, as I've bought it in January. Everything sounds normal, acceleration and speed was good...so no way to expect what I have found there...

I need the Bronco for holidays in December with the kids...so as I have to drive about 1,500 miles, I want to be sure, that the old boy is able to do that :LOL:

My "oldies" (I have three of them) gets new engine oil, fuel filters and sparks every year.
Every second year new gear-oil, differential-oil and cooling water. So, if the enginne is still solid, It will be last some more years in my hands. You have to mention, that I'm from germany...I drive about 10,000 miles per year at maximum with that car... ;)
 

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OK, thanks for that!
Yeah, my plan to continue was nearly as you mentioned:
  • removing the heads and clean them up
  • check the cylinders, pistons and the rings
  • remove and clean the oil-pan
  • check the connecting rod and crankshaft bearings

I thought this mess may have to do with the exhaust gas recirculation...but it doesn't seems so, if I follow your experience.

The Bronco runs good, as I've bought it in January. Everything sounds normal, acceleration and speed was good...so no way to expect what I have found there...

I need the Bronco for holidays in December with the kids...so as I have to drive about 1,500 miles, I want to be sure, that the old boy is able to do that :LOL:

My "oldies" (I have three of them) gets new engine oil, fuel filters and sparks every year.
Every second year new gear-oil, differential-oil and cooling water. So, if the enginne is still solid, It will be last some more years in my hands. You have to mention, that I'm from germany...I drive about 10,000 miles per year at maximum with that car... ;)
These old engines need the oil changed every 3,000 miles so should be at least 2 if not 3 times a year… spark plugs are good for 25k so typically good for 2 to 3 years.
 

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I'm not sure I'd want to disturb that unless it was going into a hot tank before running again....
 

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'88 XLT. 2" lift, 3G, Saginaw Pump, Headers, High flow 3" cat, 3" exhaust, 6 litre tune, K&N
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561 Posts
That is not what I would want to see, but that is not all bad. It could run another 50k miles like that if you start it on normal oil changes or it could fail tomorrow.

There are two ways, I see, you can go with this one:

1. Change the oil, drive it, buy AAA towing, and prepare for a replacement
2. Try to clean it the best you can.

If I were to attempt #2, I would scrape the big loose pieces and vacuum that mess out of the valley. Do the same for the engine heads after pulling the valve covers. I would then go full aggressive and use 2 quarts diesel in the crankcase or an engine flush solvent and run it for 20 minutes, (5 -10 minutes with diesel or biodiesel but watch the temp gauge). Then I would drop the oil while still hot and let drain for an hour, remove the engine mount bolts to the frame, jack up the engine 3"-4" by placing a 2 x 4 scrap under the oil pan to use a jack. Then put a few 2 by 4 scraps between the engine mounts and the frame to hold it up to give you enough clearance to pull the oil pan. Then drop the engine oil pan, clean it and remove the oil pump screen and clean it. New one piece blue Fel-pro oil pan gasket, and lower motor and bolt the engine mounts to the frame. I would say that it wouldn't hurt to change the oil pump, since you are here, but if this motor konks out anyway, it would be a waste of $60.

Then I would fill with the cheapest you can find motor oil, and filter but replace 1 -2 quarts of oil with cheap ATF to it (tranny oil is super detergent) to the motor oil. Don't over fill it.
Then I would drive it 100 miles or so, keeping an eye on the oil pressure gauge and temp gauge. The detergent ATF will dissolve a lot of the sludge slowly. It is less aggressive than using an engine flush.
Then I would drop that oil while its hot and it should be a little sludgy.
Then replace it with new good oil and good filter and hope for the best. All the loose pieces of sludge deposits should be diminished, but there will still be some big sludge pieces that are not exposed to good oil flow. Hopefully these won't break free.

Now you are not trying to remove all sludge from the motor, that is impossible, and dangerous. What you are trying to do is remove the sludge that is hampering moving parts and blocking oil passages. You should have least restored good lubrication now. Sludge pieces that are not hampering oil movement are not dangerous unless they break free and block the pickup or drain back holes.

Diesel in the crankcase makes a very good aggressive engine flush. If you are going to break a motor down for rebuild it is a great idea to use, it will free stuck rings, remove a bunch of sludge but it is not great lubrication for bearings and cylinder walls so I wouldn't run it very long or at higher rpms.
 
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1986 Bronco Eddie Bauer 5.0 mostly stock
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My crankcase valley was pretty gross when i pulled my engine apart. I put my engine on a stand with the heads off, over a deep pan and sat there with a wire brush and a whole lot of purple power and just scrubbed away until i got it all clean and felt good about it. It took a while, this isn't something i just "DID" in an hour, this was a days long process that I probably could have done a lot quicker, but i wasn't in a rush and i wanted to do it right.
I first picked all the chunks i could, then i soaked it all in purple power (simple green, totally awesome whatever water based degreaser) then i used my little harbor freight wire brushes and would give it all a scrub, then a soak, then a scrub, then a soak.
 

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85 Bronco, 309ci I6 w/4bbl, np435, 4" lift, 37" Irok NDs, 4.56 w/ Detroit Locker and tru trac
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I would completely rebuild that. Never know how much is blocking the oil passages.

I ran across an inline six like that in the junkyard once. The whole head was caked in an inch of that crap.
 

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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hi together. Thanks for the replys!

@Caddylackn
Thanks for the detailed manual. I will check all necessary things and see how deep the rebuild has to be.

Also @BigBlue 94
Yes, I also think it's necessary to rinse everything. I will try it like @Caddylackn with diesel. Never heared this before.

I also can get a 400cui engine for replacement. But this engine is also used, and the current owner suggested also to rebuild it to be sure. As I use the Bronco as daily vehicle, and need it for holidays in December, it will may be the same afford. The 400cui also has no injection, so I think the fuel consumption may be much higher. I can't imagine that the injection of my 302cui will fit on the 400cui...

So, let's wait until I have removed the heads and see what's below...o_O

The good thing is, that I have finished my exhaust...I will post some photos as far as my pit is free again. Currently my Buggy blocks it while waiting for the correct PU-bearing for the front axle.:sleep:
 

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85 Bronco, 309ci I6 w/4bbl, np435, 4" lift, 37" Irok NDs, 4.56 w/ Detroit Locker and tru trac
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Diesel works well. I used to use Kerosene in my parts washer. Its a cruder and oilier fuel but similar to diesel.

No, your 302 stuff wont fit the 400. Well, the heads would fit but thats it. The EFI system and intake only fit 302 and 289 ci engines.

First step, as someone mentioned, is to physically scrape and vacuum all that you can. Then pour in the diesel. Remove the distributor and use a drill to spin the oil pump in the same rotation the distributor turns. This will flush the diesel through all the oil passages. Then get the cheapest oil you can, and do the same thing to get rid of the diesel residuals. Then drain that oil and fill with your preferred oil.

I once ran my 94 351 to almost 12,000 miles without an oil change. It did have two oil filters, but it never looked like yours! Thats like 30k miles or something lol.
 
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After you get it running. Throw half a quart of Marvel Mystery Oil in the crankcase. Run it for about 200 miles dump the oil. New oil Add the second half of the quart do it again. It will break up alot of the junk you couldnt get to and help clean it up. New oil filter each time. Cheap 15/40 oil. Done it on a handful of sludge motors and it works wonders.
 

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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
@Kacz0351
Thanks for this. My answer has taken some time...very busy at work...

By now I'm cleaning the intake mainfold. Currently it sleeps in a tub of diesel...

I have decided to remove the engine. As I have a full set of seals, I also can change the backside crankshaft seal and the most important thing is, that I can work and clean the engine better than when it's installed.

I hope I'll get the engine out without removing the whole front...My plan is to first remove the heads and then the rest of the engine...

Glove Safety glove Gesture Finger Tar

Tire Automotive tire Tread Wood Grey

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I think I also need all new injectors...I will send some photos of the engine, when I have removed it tomorrow...
Cheers!
 

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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yeah...don't ask...the rest of the car is very, very tidy. No rust and a good interior. Also the engine's outside was OK. It runs good as I've bought it...So no way to expect what's inside... :rolleyes:
 

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@Kacz0351
Thanks for this. My answer has taken some time...very busy at work...

By now I'm cleaning the intake mainfold. Currently it sleeps in a tub of diesel...

I have decided to remove the engine. As I have a full set of seals, I also can change the backside crankshaft seal and the most important thing is, that I can work and clean the engine better than when it's installed.

I hope I'll get the engine out without removing the whole front...My plan is to first remove the heads and then the rest of the engine...

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I think I also need all new injectors...I will send some photos of the engine, when I have removed it tomorrow...
Cheers!
Just have those injectors cleaned. Most injector shops charge 17 bucks an injector to clean, test and rebuild if necessary. The OE bosch injectors are by far the best. Even new bosch injectors do not have the same quality and cost a ton. Save yourself a ton of money AND have superior parts. Also from the looks of it an engine tear down does seem like the way to go. Good luck. Keep us posted on your progress!
 

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1990 EB, 5.8, E4OD, 32x12.50
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hallo! I think I have you beat on the amount of sludge in the engine. My 90 5.8 had oil caked all over the outside all the way back to the transmission so I thought I’d start at the top and work my way down changing gaskets and the water pump was leaking. I pulled the intake off this morning and this is what I found. I filled a plastic grocery bag half full scraping with my hand before I got the shop vac and screw driver out. It did clean up pretty good by the time I was done. Tomorrow I’ve got to take the timing pump cover off as I broke 2 studs for the water pump off. If that goes well, I’ll clean up what I can, then I’ll pull the valve covers and see what mess I find. Eventually I’ll pull the oil pan and clean it up too before I start it up. I’m not going to get too crazy with it. I’m guessing it’s got about 240k miles on it and smokes out the breather, but it runs. I figure I’ll clean it the best I can and run it. I plan to put some 15-40 delvac in it and hope for the best. I’ll try some motor flush at the next oil change too and see if anything else comes out.
 

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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
OK...now the heads are off..luckily everything looks good. The cylinders, the pistons, the heads as it self.



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The waste inside were not inside the cylinders...

So I have to change some parts and I need your help for some...

But first about the cylinder-head screws...can I re-use them? I have bought new ones from Mahle, but this ones don't have the fiiting at the shaft...the have a full threat. I have boght this ones: RockAuto
My original looks like this: RockAuto

My Alternator has to be changed...but I don't find the right one at RockAuto...here is my original:
Automotive tire Motor vehicle Rim Bicycle part Automotive wheel system

Automotive tire Gas Auto part Machine Motor vehicle

Wood Gas Machine Automotive tire Electric blue

Here is what I can get: RockAuto

About the injectors: I seem to don't have the original Bosch as @Kacz0351 said... so I have decided to by new ones Rockauto

I also ask myself if it will be useful to replace the AGR-Vent:
Automotive tire Vehicle brake Bicycle part Bicycle tire Bicycle fork


Next weekend I will remmove the oil-pan to check the crankshaft and piston bearing.
Is there any trick to remove the pan? Only way to lift the engine? I also need new engine bearings...

Thanks for your help.
 

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1985 Bronco XLT, 5.0 EFI, C6
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Hey together!

I have to order some spare-parts and I'm not sure at some if they are the right ones...So if all parts come from the USA, it takes some time to get em here to Germany... ;)

First about the cylinder-head screws...can I re-use them? I have bought new ones from Mahle, but this ones don't have the fiiting at the shaft...the have a full threat. I have boght this ones: RockAuto
My original looks like this: RockAuto

My Alternator has to be changed...but I don't find the right one at RockAuto...images of my original are in my post upon.
Here is what I can get: RockAuto

About the injectors: I seem to don't have the original Bosch as @Kacz0351 said... so I have decided to by new ones Rockauto
I also can get this ones but I don't know if they are even fit. Seller writes use for 1990-1996.

I also ask myself if it will be useful to replace the AGR-Vent. Do you think this is necessary or useful?
I have read that the AGR should stay, also if there is no exhaust gas recirculation in use.

I also thought about changing the waterpump to a aluminium high volume version. The installed is made of steel. A bite rusty outside, but the bearing seems to be OK.

Thanks again for your help.
 
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