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hi all,
I have a 95 xlt and i want to keep it FOREVER, but i want to replace my stock v8(130,000miles) with a diesel so i can use biodiesel and get 40mpg for 50 cents a gallon. i dont know much about mechanics so i dont even know if this swap is possible, but if anyone could offer advice on to where to get started, or constructive ridicule, i would appreciate it. basically i'm curious of what engine to buy, where, where to sell the old one, and costs involved especially in paying someone to switch em. Thanks! i live in NJ
 

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well first off i don't think any here has tried it yet but there has been a lot of talk about it! next you won't get 40mpg with bio or reg fuel maybe 20 or so but probably more like 18. another thing is that motor is extremely heavy and you will need a new front suspension, better brakes to stop it all, all new fuel plumbing and now comes the fun part...if you want to get a later model 7.3 then you would almost have to swap everything over including ALL the wiring, instrument cluster maybe a dash so it all looks right, the rad, trans, probably a x-case & rear axle since your won't hold up to the torque. the list goes on and on. but those are just my thoughts, others will chime in.

Travis
 

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for god's sake. A guy just posted a swap like 2 days ago. Lots of pics and everything.

Another person did it with a power stroke IIRC.

The first thing you need to do is learn to use search.

Sorry, I know you are brand new, I am not trying to be an ass (mission failed I am sure), but this was done just days ago.

Be sure to check out yahoo groups. I think it is 4bt cummins or something along that line. In addition, ford cummins (google search).

here: http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61534&highlight=diesel
 

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You won't get 40 MPG in anything but a little 2 or 3 liter diesel

Maybe find an Isuzu/GMC/Hino/Mitsu-Fuso truck and grab the 234 turbo (3.9L) 4 cylinder out of it along with the transmission, there usully a 5 speed auto, and swap it in there. It won't be the fastest on the hills, but it will get you up to speed on the freeway just fine. Might average 30 MPG too
 

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MikE2 said:
You won't get 40 MPG in anything but a little 2 or 3 liter diesel

Maybe find an Isuzu/GMC/Hino/Mitsu-Fuso truck and grab the 234 turbo (3.9L) 4 cylinder out of it along with the transmission, there usully a 5 speed auto, and swap it in there. It won't be the fastest on the hills, but it will get you up to speed on the freeway just fine. Might average 30 MPG too

VW Diesel Jetta engines were getting 50 mpg, but that is a lot smaller vehicle and doesn't have the drive train losses that a heavy 4x4 drive would have.

96ProjectBronco
 

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DFern said:
hi all,
I have a 95 xlt and i want to keep it FOREVER, but i want to replace my stock v8(130,000miles) with a diesel so i can use biodiesel and get 40mpg for 50 cents a gallon. i dont know much about mechanics so i dont even know if this swap is possible, but if anyone could offer advice on to where to get started, or constructive ridicule, i would appreciate it. basically i'm curious of what engine to buy, where, where to sell the old one, and costs involved especially in paying someone to switch em. Thanks! i live in NJ

Well, your first problem is finding a biodiesel place in NJ. Your second problem is finding it for $.50 a gallon, because you won't. It's barely cheaper then regular diesel out in places that actually produce it.

As everyone else has said, SEARCH. Few guys have done it. If you don't know much about mechanics, its going to cost you an arm and a leg to pay someone else to do it, more then your Bronco is worth. Get your 302 or 351 rebuilt, baby it and keep up on the maintenance of it, and and a comparable diesel to your engine might break even with its added MPG in about 5 years.
 

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y not just go buy a diesel, for the money you spend for a good F250 or 350 you will save yourself the aggrivation, time and money of building one. you say you don't know much about mechanics, well this isn't the type of project for you then. there's way too much to reinforce, swap, fabricate, etc.,.....
 

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84broncorig said:
y not just go buy a diesel, for the money you spend for a good F250 or 350 you will save yourself the aggrivation, time and money of building one. you say you don't know much about mechanics, well this isn't the type of project for you then. there's way too much to reinforce, swap, fabricate, etc.,.....

DFern said:
hi all,
I have a 95 xlt and i want to keep it FOREVER....
i think he wants to keep his bronco, and put a diesel in the bronci
 

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My truck came with a diesel and its a PITA

try about 15mpg, maybe 18 with 3.55 and no lift

Bio runs about 2.55/gal i run it when i can find it

If your heart is set on a swap I recommend a 12v Cummins or a 7.3 IDI for ease of installation... but you should really think this over good before trying it.

A 12v Cummins will cost you $3500 for a cheap one from a junk yard, plus a conversion kit, clutch (or automatic trans for about $3900), and they are a joke in stock form not to mention unmodded the fuel milage is not that great

You could have a whole IDI truck for $3500, have most of the parts you need and not completely break the bank... but those motors are hopelessly slow with no room for modding. Even if someone made the parts to juice it up the internals are too weak to make much power. They need 4:10 rears to keep up with traffic and the fuel milage would be about the same as a small block V8

Then you need to rework the suspention in the front with heavy leafs or possibly dodge diesel coils... more $$$

Do yourself a favor and go buy an ex-military blazer w/ the 6.2 diesel... piss slow but you get one ton running gear with detroits and they actually do pretty good on fuel with some 35's to offset the stock 4.56 gears

EDIT: it would probably be easier to put a bronco body on a shortened f-350 frame
 

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/==0=\ said:
and they are a joke in stock form not to mention unmodded the fuel milage is not that great
no no no.....unmodded the fuel milage is great, The old 160/400 has many people getting a 26 mpg average with 3.54 gears.
And in stock form they are adaquate as long as you have a manual transmission. With an automatic they suck
 

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/==0=\ said:
A 12v Cummins will cost you $3500 for a cheap one from a junk yard, plus a conversion kit, clutch (or automatic trans for about $3900), and they are a joke in stock form not to mention unmodded the fuel milage is not that great

Then you need to rework the suspention in the front with heavy leafs or possibly dodge diesel coils... more $$$

EDIT: it would probably be easier to put a bronco body on a shortened f-350 frame
Few things here...but for the most part he's right.

I'm the guy involved in that swap mentioned here:
http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61534&highlight=diesel

Honestly I have no idea how much this swap would cost the average person. Our environment is a tiny bit different. And yeah, stock those motors aren't all that great...I believe our Cummins was rated at 175 HP. The torque will still pull a building down though. We added a Banks turbo kit with nearly twice the boost pressure, so it should be a lot better. As far as fuel economy...screw it. We're not building this to cost less to operate, especially with diesel prices these days...the 5.0HO Mustang motor we had in it before probably got better mileage. I, for one, would rather suffer the fuel economy and drive a truck rather than a honda.

As far as the springs go...we had custom springs wound from www.coilsprings.com, which are both 2" lift springs, and a much higher rate than stock. With the cummins motor and our huge bumper/plow on the front, it still gives 1.5" lift over stock springs. We also have a HP44 SAS, with Chevy 10-bolt 8-lug outers...soon to be swapped out for a HP60. No problems there. With the TTB though, you'll probably have some funky camber problems...I wouldn't waste my time with that setup.

The F350 frame was something we considered because we had one of those too...but it seemed like it was going to be a lot easier just welding in a few additional crossmembers and stuff. A side-by-side comparison of the frames wasn't really that much different. I think if I were going to work off a 350 frame I'd rather just build a Centurion-style thing instead.
 

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man, it is like great post after great post with you vette. Damn I hope to see a write up of this in some mag. Not that the one you have done isn't awesome, but I like flipping pages and looking at pics.
 

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rugerp89ipsc said:
man, it is like great post after great post with you vette. Damn I hope to see a write up of this in some mag. Not that the one you have done isn't awesome, but I like flipping pages and looking at pics.
Yes, he has some very good points with attempting to do this with a TTB, which of course can't be done with any sized diesel as Vette found out...need a whole new crossmember, which really means you need to add a whole new front axle to this project. Unless you consider a diesel MUCH smaller than what vette was using. Perhaps as Mike suggested an Isuzu (which is what I would go after if the poster really wants MPG) 6 (still big) or a 4cylinder even better, about 4 liters or so. maybe turbo/intercool (though in mud that might not be good), and you likely could dip into the 20's with your brick.

scoring biodiesel, better yet scoring for .50 is total BS.

vetteboy also spared everyone the detail on fuel tank, lines, etc. that can make this project VERY costly. gaining it back on the miracle 30MPG and .50 a gal is not thinking clearly.
 

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MikE2 said:
no no no.....unmodded the fuel milage is great, The old 160/400 has many people getting a 26 mpg average with 3.54 gears.
And in stock form they are adaquate as long as you have a manual transmission. With an automatic they suck

I stand corrected, I recall I have a friend with an '89 Cummins that claims 24mpg turning 35's with 4.10's

Man I'd toss some 370 injectors and a HX40 on that bronco and tear up some truck pulls!
 

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Shadofax said:
vetteboy also spared everyone the detail on fuel tank, lines, etc. that can make this project VERY costly. gaining it back on the miracle 30MPG and .50 a gal is not thinking clearly.
Oh man...that silicone-lined fuel hose is expensive as hell. We actually kept the stock fuel tank, and I removed the pump from inside and did some brazing to extend the pickup to the bottom of the tank. We snagged the filler neck off a Powerstroke truck to have the right size fill hole.

The HP44 was in there already; we did that about a year and a half ago. But yes, clearance is TIGHT. We addressed it pretty thoroughly, and I'm still not comfortable with the amount of uptravel available (let's not even get into the larger pumpkin on the HP60), so I will be adding another inch or so under the coil springs. That and decent bumpstopping should take care of it - and it's got about a 1.5" rake towards the front anyway, so it's not a bad thing to do.

It may be sacrilege on a board like this (I'm new here haha), but I think one of the most effective swaps would be a Cummins 4BT. If you find one out of a bread van or something, the motor mounts AND bellhousing are identical to a Chevy small-block motor, because they made that 4BT to be a direct swap for vans needing a new motor. The large amount of transmission/t-case options, plus the 'standard' small block mount pattern make this a really appealing swap IMO.

Shadofax is definitely right though - ANY project like this will nickel and dime you to death. I'd hate to see what the total investment in this project is so far, and we haven't even had to buy any of the drivetrain.
 

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4bt is what anothe rmember on here got me looking at. Those engines are getting around 25 miles to the gal. he directed me to this yahoo groups. Don't believe there is a fsb on there with a swap, but these is an old school bko with one swapped in. Depending on where you live, the engines are readily available.

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/cummins4BT/

this thread is also helpful http://classicbroncos.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67054

and this is a fairly helpful website if you are completely green.

http://home.comcast.net/~jcmiley/cummins.htm

Lastly, I think the poster was not thinking of buying biodiesel at the pump, which I imagine is a feat in itself. I assumed (dangerous, I know) that the poster wanted to brew the biodiesel. Which, of course, has a huge up start costs; however, it can be done much cheaper then buying at th epump, and depending on how much u use it/drive/brew it can, just like reloading ammo, can save money.

I am currently researching this for my parents since they now live in BFN only drive diesel and are having to fill up 3 times a week. There are some places in the town near by that will pay them to take the oil. Granted, you have to have some time to make the fuel. but these were helpful websites also.

http://www.freedomfuelamerica.com/

http://www.biodieselsolutions.com/store/store.asp

I think this is along the lines of what they were considering with biodiesel. Correct me if I am wrong poster.

But yeah, 4bt seems like the ideal way to go so far from what I have found. There is another member on here who knows and has researched it a hell of alot more then I have for his 79 and he pointed me in this direction. But yeah, search and ye shall find.

Again vette, thanks for all the info. I am not planning on goingnearly as big as you did, but it is still super cool to see. Have any full shots of the truck now and the suspension up front? :rockon
 
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