Bronco Forum - Full Size Ford Bronco Forum banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
New to broncos. It was a deal I couldn't pass up. Eddie Bauer 4x4, and up in Maine, we can use 4x4... more often than not.

It has a few issues. First, both the Brake and ABS light are on. The ABS light comes on shortly after driving (most likely around 6mph when the computer does its test). Check engine light is on as well, but I haven't had a chance to pull the codes. The brake fluid is full (I had to add to it, but it is full). There are two wire connections. One on the very end going into a red sensor with a note about replacing the entire harness if the fusible link fails, and one small square connector going into the bottom of the fluid tank. I assume the one in the tank is the level sensor? Whats the other one for?

It shifts hard going into gear, and it shifts hard from gear to gear (1 to 2, 2 to 3, etc) It seems like its electronic, and I've read that ABS/brake system can cause issues with the transmission shifting hard/funny.

Looking for some input on common things to look at (minus the brake fluid and tranny fluid, both are at the appropriate levels) to try and get the lights out and transmission functioning. The previous owner indicated the ABS was actually working as it kicked in on him several times even with the light on.
 

·
Driving Stuff Henry Built
-90 xlt, 351w, e4od, man 1356, 3.55, sag, warn hubs, 35s. -73, 400, np435, d20j twin, 35s
Joined
·
8,411 Posts
I'm no trans guy, but here's my 2 cents. You might want to check the VSS on the rear axle, & its wiring. Both the trans & ABS use input from the VSS. Hard shifting is a sign of the trans going into limp mode, where it shifts in the absence of normal input. Is the OD light on the shifter blinking? Does it light if you press the button? You should pull the codes (I believe on a 95 the CEL & codes also cover trans & ABS issues). Also, take a look thru stangmata's E4OD Diagnosis Thread. It covers a lot of trans issues.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Thanks, I should have mentioned I know about the VSS. The VSS also supplies speedometer input right? The speedometer works fine, but I do understand that only parts of the sensor could be bad. Is it possible for the speedometer to work fine and the sensor to be screwed up while supplying information to the abs/tranny?

The OD OFF light is not flashing. It does work, because when I press the OD OFF button, the light comes on. First thing I looked for.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Update. Float was stuck in master cylinder. Brake light is now out. ABS light comes on shortly after moving. Tranny still shifting hard. A friend told me the sensor in the pumpkin only controls ABS. The one in the transmission/transfer case controls speedo and shifting.
 

·
Driving Stuff Henry Built
-90 xlt, 351w, e4od, man 1356, 3.55, sag, warn hubs, 35s. -73, 400, np435, d20j twin, 35s
Joined
·
8,411 Posts
for a real trans guy.

Update. Float was stuck in master cylinder. Brake light is now out. ABS light comes on shortly after moving. Tranny still shifting hard. A friend told me the sensor in the pumpkin only controls ABS. The one in the transmission/transfer case controls speedo and shifting.
That ^ is true in older Broncos. By 95 they use one in the rear end for both tasks. There shouldn't be a VSS on the t-case on a 95, unless someone has swapped in an older setup.

I'll throw in what I know, but it's not worth much. My truck is older, & has the separate sensors for ABS & trans. Yes, in newer trucks like yours the speedo also uses the same VSS. I don't think it could work good enough for the speedo, but not good enough for the trans. I do think there is a point in the wiring where the connection wyes off to the PSOM for the speedo. I wonder if the connection were bad to the trans side, if the speedo might still work, but don't really know. I also believe the OD Off light normally blinks when the trans goes into the limp mode. Since yours is off, I don't think its in limp mode. So, no real help from me. Hopefully the pros will find this.

Look thru that thread I linked above, & pull your codes (How To Run a Self-Test). If you don't find what you need there, or someone doesn't jump in here, thePUNISHER isn't on FSB much anymore, but he seems to know those trannies. You might check out the 1st post in this thread & send him a pm, email, or give him a call.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Cool. I'm going to pull the sensor and check it out and see whats up. Check the connection, check the sensor for metal shavings, etc. Interesting a simple 2 wire sensor can provide input for the speedo, abs, and transmission.

I appreciate your responses. They've been most helpful. I also noticed it has quite a bit of slop in the steering. I gotta get under and check to see if its wearable parts like tie rods that are causing the slop or something else.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
23,549 Posts
pull the codes. best place to start. Trying to T/S something with out knowing the codes makes repair alot harder.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
9,695 Posts
You really need to pull codes. check out www.fordfuelinjection.com for instructions and code meanings. It literally takes only 10 mins to do and will provide us with valuable information to help you diagnose your transmission problem. I can tell you from my experience, you should warm it up to operating temperature, drive it around a little, then pull the dipstick for the tranny with it running. WIpe it clean, put it back in then wipe it on a clean white cloth. What you want to see is bright red fluid with no black particles. You do not want to see any shade of brown. Brown fluid is burnt and that is a very bad sign. I have a mechanic friend that has a transmission shop that I use whenever I cant do a repair myself, and one thing he told me about these old fords is the MLPS/Neutral Safety Switch can cause alot of problems if it is going bad. Its an easy check too. Just look under the truck where the shift lever goes into the transmission. There should be a black box with a connector on top. If that box looks really old or original, it could be a source of trouble. Its another cheap, easy, quick fix for many problems.

Pull codes, it will point you in the right direction. Usually you will get multiple codes. Most of the time I have found there is only one thing wrong with a particular system, but it will throw multiple codes. FIx the one problem and all the other codes will clear.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
27,002 Posts
It has a few issues. First, both the Brake and ABS light are on. The ABS light comes on shortly after driving (most likely around 6mph when the computer does its test). Check engine light is on as well, but I haven't had a chance to pull the codes. The brake fluid is full (I had to add to it, but it is full). There are two wire connections. One on the very end going into a red sensor with a note about replacing the entire harness if the fusible link fails, and one small square connector going into the bottom of the fluid tank. I assume the one in the tank is the level sensor? Whats the other one for?QUOTE]


yo,
ABS LIGHT
Two things you can do for Free to get to the issue

Check with Dealer on the Cruise Control Recall
Recall for 93-96 Bronco, 94-02 F-150, 97-02 Expedition & 98-02 Lincoln Navigators; NHTSA Campaign id number: 05v388000, 07v336000 & 05v017000; recall date Jan 27, 2005 & update; (search for 07v336000 & 05v017000 in "safety recalls) on certain sport utility vehicles and pickup trucks, the speed control deactivation switch is leaking & may overheat, smoke, or burn this condition could lead to a fire. Fires have occurred while the vehicles were parked with the ignition 'off.' as an interim repair, owners will be instructed to return their vehicles to their dealers to have the speed control deactivation switch disconnected. As soon as replacement parts are available (early April 2005), owners will be instructed to return to the dealers for installation of a new switch free of charge. Owners may contact ford at 1-800-392-3673. (note: also see recalls 05v388 and 06v286) Ford recall no. 05s28. Customers may also contact the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's vehicle safety hotline at 1-888-327-4236 (TTY 1-800-424-9153), OR GO TO HTTP://WWW.SAFERCAR.GOV
Source: by Ford & NHTSA via miesk5 at FSB



There have been UPdates to this recall.. incl new switch, harness, etc.

Some dealers claim that the Recall is over or the Bronco does not qualify for it now because it is too late to file for or the Bronco is too "old" for it to apply... BUT, that is Wrong!
read these;
"took it to the dealer today and got a new one installed free ." 12 April 2011
Source: by tr21triton at FSB

Recall Problem; "...I have a 95 Bronco and back in feb.-11- 2010 my rig's master cylinder's Speed Control Deactivation Switch connection caught fire, this is what the recall "speed control system" is and the recall is still on going. Just go to www.fordowner.com to find out about recalls. After contacting Fordowner.com and filing a claim they passed it on to the claims group @ FORD to be reviewed. Once the group reviewed my claim then someone got in touch with me, I have to mail copys of my title, bill of sale, ect. and copy's of photos of the damage to her. She said that the dealer dose not have parts for vehicles 10 years and older so I have to get my local shop to replace the master cylinder and the wires that were effected by the break fluid and their labor cast, she will cut me/the shop a check and then after the work is done then the dealer will look it over to make sure the truck and the work is up-to-date. All this to fix something that at most costs $200. WTF..."
Source: by Belafox at FSB



Next is to do the 4WABS Self Test for Brake Codes;
4WABS Self Test & Test Connector Diagram, Component Locations, DTCs, 93-96; "...The 4WABS TEST Connector is red; located at the left-hand side (driver's side) of the engine compartment and marked ANTI-LOCK TEST; Light Flash Technique 1. Note: If 12V test light is not available, the amber ABS warning light also flashes during this test. Locate test connector in the engine compartment and install 12V test light between Pins C and E. 2. With the ignition off, jumper Pin E to B. 3. Turn key to RUN position. 4. Remove jumper between Pins E and B after 5 seconds. 5. Count light flashes of test light or amber ABS warning light..." read more; Source: by Steve83 (Steve, That dirty old truck) at http://www.supermotors.org/vehicles/registry/showmedia.php?id=255501&original=1
=============

It shifts hard going into gear, and it shifts hard from gear to gear (1 to 2, 2 to 3, etc) It seems like its electronic, and I've read that ABS/brake system can cause issues with the transmission shifting hard/funny.
=



The Self Test LINK to fordfuelinjection.com is JUST for the KOEO portion; he has to include the KOER Self-Test soon there or at least provide a HOT LINK to the KOER portion.

Here is a Complete Self Test for Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTC)s by my pal, BroncoJoe19
The engine temperature must be greater than 50° F for the Key On Engine Off (KOEO) Self-Test and greater than 180° F for the Key On Engine Running (KOER) Self-Test.
Run it around to heat the engine up and shift thru all gears incl Reverse. Then turn off all accessories/lights, etc.

Make sure A/C is off and transmission is in Park (automatic) or in Neutral for a Manual & release clutch.

Do Key On Engine Off (KOEO) portion first.

Look Codes up in my broncolinks.com site using the new Search function.

And Post em here according to:
KOEO
&
KOER
==

Some guesses until we see the Self Test results;

Limp Mode; "...If all the shifts are hard, the computer is going into limp mode which causes the trans to shift hard because the pressures are increased. The computer goes into limp mode when it senses an error in the transmission shifting or electrical system. The most common cause for this is the transmission range sensor. This is the sensor that is bolted to the drivers side of the transmission case with the shift lever arm going through the center of the sensor. Try disconnecting the battery for 15 minutes with the headlamps on.
This should clear the limp mode and return the transmission to normal shift strategy. If it does then the problem is intermittent. If it still shifts hard then the fault is continuously occurring. It is possible that there is another input/output signal problem, but 99% of the time it is the range sensor especially if it clears limp mode proving the problem is intermittent..."

Limp Mode; "...The throttle position sensor signal takes the place of the throttle kickdown linkage on older mechanical automatics. So if the TPS is reading high or low, or has a dead spot, it can affect transmission kickdown shifts when accelerating, as well as normal upshifts and downshifts, too. If the TCM cannot get a good TPS signal, it may substitute a "calculated" throttle angle provided by the PCM over the data bus. Or, if this signal is not available, it may substitute a fixed value for the TPS signal. This will obviously affect the way it shifts (transmission typically hunts for shift points) but not necessarily cause it to go into a limp-in mode. A faulty throttle position sensor will not always set a fault code. The PCM has to be smart enough to figure out when the TPS is working properly and when it is not. Its diagnostic strategies may compare the TPS signal against engine rpm, MAP signal and/or airflow to determine if the TPS signal makes sense. If the TPS signal does not correspond to other sensor inputs that can be used to measure engine load, the PCM may set a fault code. Then again, it might not. It all depends on the self-diagnostic strategy, how sensitive it is to faults and how easily the PCM can detect problems. Under certain conditions, which may include the loss of one or more vital inputs to the TCM, the transmission will go into some kind of limp-in or defaul mode. When a serious fault is diagnosed (such as loss of an internal speed sensor signal) or a problem occurs in the wiring circuit to any of the shift solenoids, the TCM will kill the power to the transmission control relay and deenergize all of the shift solenoids. This usually causes the transmission to freeze in 2nd or 3rd gear. The transmission will remain in limp-in mode until (1) the problem is diagnosed and repaired, or (2) power to the TCM is momentarily turned off to reset the computer. This may restore normal operation temporarily, but as soon as the TCM detects the fault again, it will go back into limp-in mode..."


DTC 62, 628 and/or 1728 Transmission Shifts Hard TSB 98-4-19 in 90-96 Bronco; 89-97 F SUPER DUTY, F-250 HD, F-350; 89-98 Econoline, F-150, F-250 LD; 97-98 Expedition
Source: by Ford
This TSB article is being republished in its entirety to correct the vehicles listed. ISSUE: Some vehicles may exhibit a flashing Transmission Control Indicator Lamp (TCIL) and Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTCs) 62, 628, and/or 1728 may be stored in memory. These DTCs can be set by any internal transmission element slippage or potentially by torque converter slippage. ACTION: Refer to the following text when servicing these codes. NOTE: WHEN SERVICING A VEHICLE WITH A FLASHING TCIL WITH DTCS 62, 628 AND/OR 1728, DO NOT REPLACE THE TORQUE CONVERTER UNLESS PROPER DIAGNOSIS HAS PROVEN THE TORQUE CONVERTER TO BE THE CAUSE. Always verify the customer concern. Proper diagnosis for DTCs 62, 628 and/or 1728 may require talking to the customer to find out if there were any other symptoms associated with the TCIL flashing, (i.e., shift concerns, erratic/early/late, proper torque converter operation, etc.), prior to noticing the TCIL flashing. Prior to transmission repairs for DTCs 62, 628 and/or 1728 or investigating other causes, repair all non-related transmission DTCs first, then repair all other transmission DTCs other than 62, 628 and/or 1728. Some of the other causes that may result in DTCs 62, 628 and/or 1728 are as follows: - Aftermarket modifications (i.e., performance enhancers, electrical modifications, etc.) - Missing shifts (some/all) - Transmission fluid leakage (internal and/or external) - Erratic shift timing - Valves, springs or retainers in the main control/accumulator body not assembled correctly, binding or sticking - Check balls missing and/or mislocated. Damaged, unable to seal/seat properly - Higher or lower than normal line pressure - Transmission fluid restrictions and/or level - Erratic/inoperative vehicle speed and/or rpm sensor - Poor engine performance concerns Any vehicle system concerns that could cause the strategy to detect a perceived internal slippage or change in the expected rpm of internal transmission rotating components may cause DTCs 62, 628 and/or 1728 to set. NOTE: ONCE DTCs 62, 628 AND/OR 1728 SET, OTHER TRANSMISSION FUNCTIONAL DTCs MAY NOT SET..." by miesk5 at FSB...


Erratic/Hard Shifting Due to Short Circuits, Common Locations TSB 95-02-11 in 94-95 Bronco & Trucks (Also happened in our 96 w/E4OD); Miesk5 NOTE; See: C. & D. Erratic/Hard Shifting
Source: by Ford via Chilton



Since PSOM looks good; discount VSS (also called RABS Sensor & Differential Speed Sensor (DSS)) for now; could be bad connection (bad/corroded wire, corroded/loose, damaged connector or terminal within connector) at PSOM (connector C252), @ PCM (CC185) or at E4OD

VSS Wiring Diagram in a 95 from FORD EVTM

by FORD via Steve83
Source: by SeattleFSB (Seattle FSB) at SuperMotors.net
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top