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Discussion Starter #1
Hey Six and anyone else, I plan on doing the ignition upgrades on my BKO. I wanted to order these from summit but want your input(expertise) on them

Accel ignition kit
http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&part=ACC-TST14&FROM=MG


And Accel Coil
http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&part=ACC-140012&FROM=MG

What do you think of all the ignition parts, you think they will be a good upgrade. I am looking to get more power out of the 5.0 302.



I plan on buying these summit headers next for some more uumpphh
http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&part=SUM-G9035&FROM=MG

All the ignition stuff will run 150 and the headers will be an additional 145. So 300 for it all!!

Then after that, for good measure I want to do the elec fans, trans cooler&filter, high flow cat & flowmaster, all in that order. You think that will help her run better. Then after all that a lift than a new paintjob.

I just bought a bunch of interior/exterior goodies that I plan on posting about soon. Its all secret since I think I will be the first on the board with those upgrades.:twotu:
So let me have it, any suggestion comments are appreciated, thx mogley.
 

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Give it a shot....I prefer the MSD 8227 coil, FoMoSpt 9mm wires, got an MSD dizzy (or rather cap and rotor) gap plugs to .54, run it a week or so and bump your timing up to 13 - 13.5*...I think Six uses this set up as well....I am pleased....the jury is still out in my mind about headers, somehow I heard that a single exhaust with stock manifolds gives more torque gains than headers....Six has a "custom" (i.e. hand built) 2.25 " Y pipe with header flanges, into 3" single out thorugh hi flo cat....dont know if he is muffled, but if you go that route, the wisdom of the board is a 40...
and what kind of secret stuff...from your avatar I can imagine a 50 cal....now that would make mall crawling something special!
 

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Practicing Infidel
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GHOSTRIDER said:
Give it a shot....I prefer the MSD 8227 coil, FoMoSpt 9mm wires, got an MSD dizzy (or rather cap and rotor) gap plugs to .54, run it a week or so and bump your timing up to 13 - 13.5*...I think Six uses this set up as well....I am pleased....the jury is still out in my mind about headers, somehow I heard that a single exhaust with stock manifolds gives more torque gains than headers....Six has a "custom" (i.e. hand built) 2.25 " Y pipe with header flanges, into 3" single out thorugh hi flo cat....dont know if he is muffled, but if you go that route, the wisdom of the board is a 40...
and what kind of secret stuff...from your avatar I can imagine a 50 cal....now that would make mall crawling something special!

Right you are GhostRider


Whats a 40 ?



Mogley

If you're going to Summit anyway, you can buy better ignition stuff for way less than $150.00, in my experience.

You can get Taylor SpiroPros(TAY-74658 Blue) for only $42.99. The MSD (MSD-8227) coil is only $46.88.

The very nice MSD cap Ghostrider is talking about(with rotor and seperator cap top) is on sale for $16.88 at the moment. That deal beats all other caps and rotors pricewise and it's by far the nicest unit available IMO.

By my p!$$ poor cypherin' skills, that leaves you $43.35 to hop down to the nearest local auto store and pick up the cheapest Autolites (or Motorcraft) plugs money can buy. Spend the remaining $30.00 you save on my last suggestion.

Most everyone here agrees 5.0 litres do not like fancy plugs. They seem to run best on the Autolites or Motorcrafts, and I agree. Just remember to gap em' out to .055, that'll wake your puppy up.

BTW people here recommended the Ford Racing 9mm wires, so I tried them on my 5.0 litre in the Lincoln last time and I'd have to say they seem just as good as the taylors IMO.

What's more the stealership made me an offer I couldn't refuse on them (beat the taylors). If you're going there for plugs ask em' and see.

When it comes to shorties, I'd hold off til' later, like Ghostrider suggests. There's a couple of real good reasons, the first being this for just a bit more than the shorties cost;

http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28101&highlight=streetgang+catco

and here;

http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28437&highlight=streetgang+catco

The reasons you want to do this Y-pipe first are;

1.) your pair of cats are now 18 model years old and they ain't in what you'd call prime shape. The stock Y-pipe is diabolically bad with the different severe bends, restrictions and kinks.

It is also a major liability for off roading the way that first cat hangs down vunerable under the stock crossmember.

Crawl under the truck and look at that terrible pipe they've got taking you from the passenger's manifold into the first cat. Then freak out over the "S" bend after that cat and into the next cat. P!$$ poor at best !

2.) This one straightens things out, improves flow vastly(double pipes).

3.) updates you to a better 3 stage modern cat. It also has provisions for the stock 02 sensor.

4.) gets you at least 4" more ground clearance and tucks it all up ABOVE the crossmembers out of harm's way.

5.) Improving flow ahead and behind the stock Y-pipe and cats, with shorties and a catback is just a waste of cash until you remove "the dam" in the middle that's blocking things up on you.

6.) It's a completely legal, affordable, absolutely bolt-on improvement that will compliment shorties later but more importantly free up a boatload of torque for you RIGHT NOW with your stock manifolds.

7.) At $191.39 it's only $46.44 more than your shorties and it's easier and faster to install. Wait a minute ! We saved you at least $30.00 in the ignition parts right ! That means you're only looking for $16.44 ! The Summit #s are CTO-9303.

8.) I challenge you to bolt this up to the stock muffler and tailpipe(save a buck or two for a while) and see the difference using just stock "cat back" components.

You'll see, like I did, the "cat back" improvements are minimal to the kind of torque you're gonna unleash by un-daming that Y-pipe and stock cats.

After a few weeks or months of the gas savings you're gonna realize, that should pay for the shorties, if you even still want them.

Best I can do for you Mogley

Sixlitre
 

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the summit headers are junk(IMO)...i have them...if you do buy them make sure you grind off the extra material on the surface that meats the head...there was weld bead around each tube...i dont understand how they expect it to seal like that...mine leaked like crazy....save your header headaches until later...
if you dont have exhaust at all yet then get a ypipe back done...itll sound good and give you a little more power...dont expect alot of power out of headers...unless ur manifolds are cracked i would forget headers....

i have the taylor wires and msd cap/rotor...no coil yet but gonna be buying the MSD one...autolite plugs do just fine BTW...no need for fancies...

spend the money for your headers on the trans cooloer and filter...much more importtant...or get something like some warn manual hubs or a 3g swap

you can do much cooler/better stuff w/ 150 then headers that will leak...btw all that shiny black paint will burn off the first time you start it and smell like a$$!!!

dc
 

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Ex Navy Nuke
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I agree with Six. The Blue Ford Racing 9mm wires are $39.88 from Summit and the MSD and Accel coils are about the same. Advance and Autozone both carry that Accel dist cap and rotor in stock(that's where I got my last 2). Use regular $.99 Autolite copper with this combo and you WILL be happy. Like Six said you will also save a good chunk of money.

If there's one thing I've learned over the years it's that just because a company offers a group price on several items that doesn't always mean that you will save money by going that route. Usually it's just the opposite because very rarely will you find a set like that with everthing you need and just the way you would've pieced it together yourself. I usually look at deals like that but I almost always end up pieceing together everthing so I get exactly what I want and not a bunch of extra stuff that I didn't need/want.
 

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DcSkater602 said:
...btw all that shiny black paint will burn off the first time you start it and smell like a$$!!!

dc
You're killin' me Dc !:histerica :histerica :histerica :histerica

I'd agree on the paint, I had mine cerma-coated. Possibly the thick coating has saved me from leaks (touch wood).

The real reason I went to shorties at all (and AFTER I'd done my Y-pipe mods) was I'm an 86er.

That means those SOBs at Ford put my only 02 sensor in the passenger's side manifold and they were notorious for busting clean off or ruining the manifold.

I figured the downtime and costs and it actually paid me to buy and install the shorties over trying to change the 02 sensor on my 20 year old original manifold.

I definately picked up "some" mid range acceleration and my 1st to second gear upshifts moved up 300 rpms to 4800, but for the money spent the Y-pipe was a far better return in every way(like you suggest).

RLKBob

I couldn't agree more on package deals. We just showed Accel up, right at Summit for Mogley. Thanks, I couldn't find the FMS wires for him at Summit.

BTW Mogley, for the same price you can have red or black ignition wires too.

Sixlitre
 

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The reason I know the price for the wires is I just bought a set. Actually the blue ones are the only ones that cheap. For some reason the red and black ones are a couple dollars more. I got mine from the stealership for $47 but with the $9.50 handling charge from Summit(even though shipping is free) they were a little cheaper than Summit in the end. I had that page and several others dog-eared in my Summit catalog. Summit likes me so much they sent me a hat with my last order.
 

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RLKBOB said:
The reason I know the price for the wires is I just bought a set. Actually the blue ones are the only ones that cheap. For some reason the red and black ones are a couple dollars more. I got mine from the stealership for $47 but with the $9.50 handling charge from Summit(even though shipping is free) they were a little cheaper than Summit in the end. I had that page and several others dog-eared in my Summit catalog. Summit likes me so much they sent me a hat with my last order.
A hat ! you lucky sod !

I didn't know Ford charged mo' fo' the red wires. I know Taylors are the same red, blue or black.

I was told last July that to get black Taylors for the Lincoln Town car (wanted it to look as close to stock as possible under the hood), I'd have to wait three weeks.

I said screw that and went to my favourite Ford dealer and he got me black FMS 9mms for even less than the Taylors and in stock IIRC (or a day or two's wait IIDRC).

Yes, that Summit catalog is killing people like PAW. They're not on-line and they charge for their catalog.

Back in the 70s I was addicted to Ed Hamburgers's 340/360 shop, but truth be known I used to buy half of what I liked at PAW because they thrashed poor Ed on price.

Well they sure got blown away by Summit when they failed to go on-line didn't they ?

Sixlitre
 

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yea i stripped my summit shorties when i got them and repainted them w/ VHT header paint...still came off and smelled lol...

im just tired of the leakyness of them...my new 351w has manifolds for now...

if you buy headers plan on adding 50 bux to the price(or more) for a set of good copper gaskets and locking bolts...you will be miserable w/out them

i definatly picked up a little power with my shorties too...just not enough to deal w/ the hassle of retightening bolts every 5 days...and the leak:shrug

headers are a good mod to do...i just think right now there are better things you could be dumping the money into... BTW headers do almost nothing if you havent opened up the exhaust after them...

dc

power from the 302 is tuff...especially in a big heavy truck like a BKO...thats why i did the 351w swap... the intake manifolds on there are fine, they flow well...if you want power i would suggest buying the cam that i got comp cams 35-255-5 and finding some irong gt40 heads of an exploder...exhaust and an intake can follow..its arguable..but it is hard to pull much more power than that froma stock 302 and keep the computer happy..just make sure as you upgrade you research what ytou are getting...you have a truck and wanna make your power down low in the rpms...anyone can build a 300-400hp 302 but you get that power at 6000 rpms, not really helpful in our 4x4's

dc
 

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DcSkater602 said:
yea i stripped my summit shorties when i got them and repainted them w/ VHT header paint...still came off and smelled lol...

im just tired of the leakyness of them...my new 351w has manifolds for now...

if you buy headers plan on adding 50 bux to the price(or more) for a set of good copper gaskets and locking bolts...you will be miserable w/out them

i definatly picked up a little power with my shorties too...just not enough to deal w/ the hassle of retightening bolts every 5 days...and the leak:shrug

headers are a good mod to do...i just think right now there are better things you could be dumping the money into... BTW headers do almost nothing if you havent opened up the exhaust after them...

dc

power from the 302 is tuff...especially in a big heavy truck like a BKO...thats why i did the 351w swap... the intake manifolds on there are fine, they flow well...if you want power i would suggest buying the cam that i got comp cams 35-255-5 and finding some irong gt40 heads of an exploder...exhaust and an intake can follow..its arguable..but it is hard to pull much more power than that froma stock 302 and keep the computer happy..just make sure as you upgrade you research what ytou are getting...you have a truck and wanna make your power down low in the rpms...anyone can build a 300-400hp 302 but you get that power at 6000 rpms, not really helpful in our 4x4's

dc

Lotta truth in your last paragraph, but I think our boy Mogley can ring some streetable torque and mileage out of his 302 for his purposes with the mods we've outlined for him (less the headers).

BTW I used the Mr. Gasket Ultraseal gaskets and that must be three years ago and to-date they still ain't leaking on me. Of course I stopped after 50 miles and tightened the living $h!t out of them header bolts, (nearly bent the wrenches kinda tight).

For better or for worse I probably way over torqued em' but F#@& the instructions:toothless I've done that to all my headers for 25 years and got away with it.

Joe's93

I'm sad to report they did not repeat the twin pipes on the 5.8 version, for whatever reason.

We were just talking about this yesterday in a similar thread and a couple of us figured you could still by the 5.0 litre system. Then take it to an exhaust shop and say "lop the the last 8" off them headpipes and weld in my 351 flanges".

The advantages stemming from the fact the end of the twin pipes are " slip-on" are endless !

You could shorten the twin pipes more than 3 feet if you wanted more room under there to put in a Flowmaster "Y" connector to get you out to 2 1/2" or 3" or bigger for a majorly large single system.

After that y'all could add a larger cat (or not) and a huge single system all the way back.

If I owned a 351 and didn't want to build another custom Y-pipe, like I did on my 5.0 litre, I'd definately consider modifying the $191.00 5.0 litre Catco twin system Y-pipe to fit it. IMO it's a great starting point.

Sixlitre
 

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I got that Accel kit for my 85 from Jegs. I'm happy with it, BUT, when it got here the rotor didn't fit, everything else was fine, but it was like pulling teeth getting the right part. Jeg's was like sorry bout your luck, but Accel (Mr.Gasket Co.) took care of it. Oh yeah I also got the Accel universal coil.... which wasn't compatible with the Accel kit..... the coil wire had the wrong terminal, so Accel sent me the right terminal along with the rotor, just had to cut and crimp it on.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Hey guys thx for the input. Guess I willl get the catco before headers, thx for that, it really makes alot of since if you think about it, I would really rather do them in the order of greatest increase of power.

I thought the accel kit was a good deal though like southfloridabronco said. It has accels top of the line wires can withstand way higher temps than others. And the cap and rotor are there good ones too. I too wondered about the plugs, since I always heard about the autolites. But they couldnt be worse though could they.

And since the accel wires can withstand temps up to 1200 degress because of the reflective coating and have ferro spiral cores they might better than alot of other wires, especially with the high heat from headers.

And about the plugs accel says " the race-proven U-Groove copper core spark plugs deliver maximum burn efficiency for improved performance and reduced emissions. " Could that make them better than the autolites. I dunno.

If I do go with the ford or taylor wires and other stuff would it be worth the 30 I would save. It seems to me the accel parts would be superior, but hey thats just what I get from reading over at summit, thats not firsthand experience.

And btw, Ive never used a timing light before:brownbag will it be hard to adjust the timing.

And is that catco pipes and cat just bolt up? Does flowmaster have a muffler with single in and dual out so I can get the dualed out look?

Thanks again for the replies guys, Ive finnaly got the money to trick out my bronco instead of the stock form its been in for a year now.:thumbup
 

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Mogley said:
Hey guys thx for the input. Guess I willl get the catco before headers, thx for that, it really makes alot of since if you think about it, I would really rather do them in the order of greatest increase of power.

I thought the accel kit was a good deal though like southfloridabronco said. It has accels top of the line wires can withstand way higher temps than others. And the cap and rotor are there good ones too. I too wondered about the plugs, since I always heard about the autolites. But they couldnt be worse though could they.

And since the accel wires can withstand temps up to 1200 degress because of the reflective coating and have ferro spiral cores they might better than alot of other wires, especially with the high heat from headers.

And about the plugs accel says " the race-proven U-Groove copper core spark plugs deliver maximum burn efficiency for improved performance and reduced emissions. " Could that make them better than the autolites. I dunno.

If I do go with the ford or taylor wires and other stuff would it be worth the 30 I would save. It seems to me the accel parts would be superior, but hey thats just what I get from reading over at summit, thats not firsthand experience.

And btw, Ive never used a timing light before:brownbag will it be hard to adjust the timing.

And is that catco pipes and cat just bolt up? Does flowmaster have a muffler with single in and dual out so I can get the dualed out look?

Thanks again for the replies guys, Ive finnaly got the money to trick out my bronco instead of the stock form its been in for a year now.:thumbup

Mogley

glad the cash is finally in your pocket to get at her. Careful not to eat up all Accel's and Summits advertising. Sounds like you're just reading off what their ad men printed there.

Like RLKBOB said, package deals are rarely the way to go, and they almost always skimp on something in the deal.

Summit is like all jobbers, Accel gives them more profit than the other specialty ignition manufacturers so they push Accel. I see that locally here too.

I relayed to you the Summit part numbers of what people here (and me) have found to work best on our Fords. If you plug those numbers into the search function at Summit you'll find em' pretty quick and you can read "their" advertising info too.

If I were you I'd stick the ignition stuff on right away as it will be saving you gas money immediately and you can redirect that money back into the Bronco.

There's plenty of threads where me and others describe how to pull the SPOUT and time the truck, so save us from carpel and do search using SPOUT, timing light, 13.5 degrees, etc.

The Catco is agreat idea and does bolt on, leaving you only a muffler and tailpipe to worry about. I'm sure Flowmaster will sell you anything you want for the cat back parts, but you can save a $h!tload of cash doing it yourself with two parts that add up to less than $90.00 and will deliver much better sound and performance, IMO

Without a doubt the best deal for a mandrel bent 2 1/2" tailpipe is the Dynomax unit at around $42.00. I want you to read this next article before you just hand over your hard earned cash to Flowmaster;

http://www.pontiacstreetperformance.com/psp/exhaust.html

Read what they say about the 2 1/4" mufflers on back two. Now consider you can get a 2 1/2" version of that same muffler that will "slip on" to the end of your 2 1/2" Catco cat and "slip into" your Dynomax mandreal bent tailpipe.

Look up that 2 1/2" muffler at Summit and you'll see how cheap it really is.

Sixlitre
 

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Dead Horse
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with the MSD coil, taylor wires, MSD cap, and motorcraft or autolite sparkplugs, will i notice a difference in performance, right now all i have is glasspacks and a k&n
 

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jb77714 said:
with the MSD coil, taylor wires, MSD cap, and motorcraft or autolite sparkplugs, will i notice a difference in performance, right now all i have is glasspacks and a k&n
JB

I did and I'm running a very high flow exhaust (not quite as loud though).

Be darn sure you open up the plug gaps and bump the timing to 13.5 degrees. If your wires are older than 2 years or low-line wires you'll definatelly notice a difference in my experience.

Sixlitre
 

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Looking at Summit, building my wishlist, a couple of questions pop up:

What's the difference between this:

http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&autofilter=1&part=CTO-9322

and this:

http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&autofilter=1&part=CTO-9303

Is the 9322 just the 9303 plus some clamps and hose?

Also, Sixlitre mentions above that he uses Taylor SpiroPros, I'm assuming the 135 degree boots. Since the MSD-3132 set is on sale right now, is it worth the extra 5 bucks to go MSD throughout (coil, cap, rotor, wires)?

With my Bronco, I got a set of Motorcraft platinum plugs, which I've put in. Should I just junk those and go with Motorcraft copper, or just regap these (free) platinums?

Lastly, how are Edelbrock shocks? Summit has rears for $19.88 on clearance. (4" lift fronts also for $19.88, but I have stock suspension.)

Thanks for any help.
 

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sewiv said:
Looking at Summit, building my wishlist, a couple of questions pop up:

What's the difference between this:

http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&autofilter=1&part=CTO-9322

and this:

http://store.summitracing.com/default.asp?target=partdetail.asp&autofilter=1&part=CTO-9303

Is the 9322 just the 9303 plus some clamps and hose?

Also, Sixlitre mentions above that he uses Taylor SpiroPros, I'm assuming the 135 degree boots. Since the MSD-3132 set is on sale right now, is it worth the extra 5 bucks to go MSD throughout (coil, cap, rotor, wires)?

With my Bronco, I got a set of Motorcraft platinum plugs, which I've put in. Should I just junk those and go with Motorcraft copper, or just regap these (free) platinums?

Lastly, how are Edelbrock shocks? Summit has rears for $19.88 on clearance. (4" lift fronts also for $19.88, but I have stock suspension.)

Thanks for any help.

Sewiv

Got me on the exhaust difference, maybe you could PM Streetgang and he'd know ? Or e-mail Catco

IMO it's worth going with the MSD coil, and they're cap and rotor are on sale right now and there ain't no flies on their wires either. Choice is yours, they're quality IMO.

I'm always stressing quality wires and so many local jobbers just carry low-line Accels which are barely as good as stock wires IMO.

Go with the platinums gapped out to .055. If they don't perform Autolites are 99 cents each.

Someone else needs to answer your shock question Sewiv

Sixlitre
 

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Discussion Starter #19
The difference in the cats are that the ones you first listed for $206 fit 87-90 broncos, the second set for $191 fit 91-95. Just click the application button at summit and it shows the years they fit.
 

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Gotcha,Mogley. Thanks.

I had entered everything except the year for my bronco.

My engine is definitely going to get the full MSD treatment, then. (Well, not the $75 spark plug wire set, just the $50.) Pretty red parts everywhere.

Now I'll have two spare coils (PO thought you fixed problems by throwing parts at it, but fortunately he kept all the old working parts and passed them on with the truck).

Exhaust will come next paycheck. It's too dang cold right now for exhaust work.

I need to bump my mileage before my GF finds out that I'm only getting 13. My `86 got 15 all the time, I don't know why this one is so bad.
 
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