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Discussion Starter #1
ok, I have a 351W w/ C6 in my 86. This is a DD with alot of highway use, turning 3k rpms is not going to work long term.

So, I would like to switch to an automatic. the engine will get some work done eventually, puts out more power than stock right now, will put out even more eventually, but still DD levels, nothing wild, moderate compression, stroked, but nothing insane.

I plan on going to EFI as the first major upgrade to the truck, just a holley sniper kit.

onto the transmissions,

AOD, AOD w/ 4R70 internals
4r70
E4OD
E4OD w/ 4R100 planetary internals?
maybe others, the 6R80/10R80


I know that the AOD swap would be the 'simplest' in that it is all mechanical and vacuum, but if I need to get one of those shift computers from US Shift for another swap that's not really an issue.

but a 35% fuel savings for EFI and OD additions (reasonable, I am at <8mpg right now), would save me over 1,000 a year, and that is just to work and back. going out for lunch, down to the lake, hunting, etc would save even more. so a swap that costs 2-3k would pay for itself within 3 years.
 

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1987 Bronco 351W, C6
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I know I want a 4R70W, but of course would need a controller. You could do an AOD with the same internals (better gearing) as the 4R70W, just need the vacuum and TV stuff off a 302 equipped truck. Would probably have Broader or Monster build it. Have you gone to the Grimm Jeeper site to see what ratios will work best?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I know I want a 4R70W, but of course would need a controller. You could do an AOD with the same internals (better gearing) as the 4R70W, just need the vacuum and TV stuff off a 302 equipped truck. Would probably have Broader or Monster build it. Have you gone to the Grimm Jeeper site to see what ratios will work best?
what are the benefits of a 4r70W internals over AOD internals? just stronger? I guess the benefits of using the AOD case at least is not needing to go get the computer and electric components, if you were doing it in a 302/AOD truck it'd be a straight swap, whereas in my case I would need to make a few changes such as TV cable and driveshafts, the last I'd have to do for either 4R70W or AOD, correct? I'm not looking to be putting huge tires or gobs of power down in this truck, I have a stroked 460, ZF5, NP205 bronco for that.
 

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Bronkin' 'Round!
94 XLT 351 E4OD 4" Superlift 88 XLT AOD about to put on 4" Pro Comp lift
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what are the benefits of a 4r70W internals over AOD internals?
The AOD became the AOD-E which then evolved into the 4R70W. It's similar to how the E4OD became the 4R100 in that some of the later parts are better revisions of earlier. 4R70W has a deeper first gear among other things. Lots of info here on this.

There also is no vacuum line, just what is called a "Throttle Valve Cable" that hooks where your current kickdown does but being carbed you'll need something aftermarket, I believe.
You would also need a flexplate for a 1989ish LTD Crown Victoria with the 351/AOD combo. The C6 one pushes the converter either too far in or too far out and the 302 one has a different imbalance.
 

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Addicted to Junk
85 Bronco, 309ci I6 w/4bbl, np435, 4" lift, 37" Irok NDs, 4.56 w/ Detroit Locker and tru trac
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The AOD became the AOD-E which then evolved into the 4R70W. It's similar to how the E4OD became the 4R100 in that some of the later parts are better revisions of earlier. 4R70W has a deeper first gear among other things. Lots of info here on this.

There also is no vacuum line, just what is called a "Throttle Valve Cable" that hooks where your current kickdown does but being carbed you'll need something aftermarket, I believe.
You would also need a flexplate for a 1989ish LTD Crown Victoria with the 351/AOD combo. The C6 one pushes the converter either too far in or too far out and the 302 one has a different imbalance.
Ill add that the E4OD is based off the c6.

A 4r70w can be had pretty easily off any 97-03 f150 with a 4.2l v6. It has the same bellhousing pattern as the SBF.
 
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Discussion Starter #6
Ill add that the E4OD is based off the c6.

A 4r70w can be had pretty easily off any 97-03 f150 with a 4.2l v6. It has the same bellhousing pattern as the SBF.
does it have a swap-able tailpiece, or do I need to find a 4wd one? 4.2L auto 4WD are kind of rare. most either went with the 8, or 2wd (like me) or at least opted for the stick if 4wd was their main priority. i.e. that's a rare combination.

I keep hearing all these horror stories on the E4OD, is it really that bad?
 

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85 Bronco, 309ci I6 w/4bbl, np435, 4" lift, 37" Irok NDs, 4.56 w/ Detroit Locker and tru trac
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does it have a swap-able tailpiece, or do I need to find a 4wd one? 4.2L auto 4WD are kind of rare. most either went with the 8, or 2wd (like me) or at least opted for the stick if 4wd was their main priority. i.e. that's a rare combination.

I keep hearing all these horror stories on the E4OD, is it really that bad?
Im not real sure. I think the one in my 99 econoline has a removable 2wd tailshaft.

No, the e4od is a good transmission. Just has to have a controller. The one in my 94 had a shift kit of some sort and it was a solid trans through all my high school shenanigans.

The one in my diesel 96 was a bit better than stock once I had a tuner installed.
 

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1987 Bronco 351W, C6
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what are the benefits of a 4r70W internals over AOD internals? just stronger? I guess the benefits of using the AOD case at least is not needing to go get the computer and electric components, if you were doing it in a 302/AOD truck it'd be a straight swap, whereas in my case I would need to make a few changes such as TV cable and driveshafts, the last I'd have to do for either 4R70W or AOD, correct? I'm not looking to be putting huge tires or gobs of power down in this truck, I have a stroked 460, ZF5, NP205 bronco for that.
Here's a writeup from Baumann. At the bottom it discusses using a "wide ratio" 4R70W gearset in an AOD.
 

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what are the benefits of a 4r70W internals over AOD internals? just stronger? I guess the benefits of using the AOD case at least is not needing to go get the computer and electric components, if you were doing it in a 302/AOD truck it'd be a straight swap, whereas in my case I would need to make a few changes such as TV cable and driveshafts, the last I'd have to do for either 4R70W or AOD, correct? I'm not looking to be putting huge tires or gobs of power down in this truck, I have a stroked 460, ZF5, NP205 bronco for that.
AODs were not very strong transmissions from the factory, and that's on cars. They were barely adequate on trucks. The 4R70W internals IIRC will get you not only a stronger gear set but a wide ration gearset. The only reason to beef up an AOD is because it does not require a computer to control it. Personally though, I would find a donor vehicle with the same engine and the desired transmission and just swap the entire EFI system. It will be cheaper than aftermarket and everything will play nice right off the bat, just a few things to figure out. 351 trucks came with the E4OD starting in 90.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
AODs were not very strong transmissions from the factory, and that's on cars. They were barely adequate on trucks. The 4R70W internals IIRC will get you not only a stronger gear set but a wide ration gearset. The only reason to beef up an AOD is because it does not require a computer to control it. Personally though, I would find a donor vehicle with the same engine and the desired transmission and just swap the entire EFI system. It will be cheaper than aftermarket and everything will play nice right off the bat, just a few things to figure out. 351 trucks came with the E4OD starting in 90.
as for going to EFI, I'll likely go with the Holley Sniper, plug and play. Vs having to actually run a new harness and such for a stock unit. And my understanding is that even with the Holley EFI, I'd still have to get the US Shift box to run an E4OD or 7R40W, correct? Not opposed to that, just wanting to make sure I have all of my ducks in a row.
 

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Bronkin' 'Round!
94 XLT 351 E4OD 4" Superlift 88 XLT AOD about to put on 4" Pro Comp lift
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AODs were not very strong transmissions from the factory, and that's on cars. They were barely adequate on trucks.

My AOD was built by Ford in 1987 and has 230k on it including 100k on the 5.8 I built. Shifts great despite so much abuse and towing things that were way too heavy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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95 Bronco, 351W, E4OD, 4.56 gears, 35x12.50x15 Patagonia MTs. 94 Bronco 5.0/E4OD/1356/3.50 gears.
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I like my E4OD's. Just like all automatics, they last a while when maintained. The issues with them was with the very early years and is no longer applicable. My F350 had the E4OD transmission rebuilt and replaced atleast 3 times during the 90's and has been great once they put one in with the newer revisions.

For what it's worth, my 95 gets 10.8-11.5 mpg average, mostly freeway. Doesnt seem to have any economy gains from going slow. My 94 with the 5.0 got 12.2 on the first tank. Overdrive helps, but only if you're geared for it. My 94 is all stock, 99k miles with a 5.0 and downshifts a lot due to the 33" tires and 3.50 gears. The 95 has 4.56 gears/35"s and is a LOT happier on the highway with that rpm difference. I wouldn't want to cruise under 2500 rpm at 80 with these things.
 

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i use 4R70W on my 90 F250 but thats because i use an Explroer 5.0 engine trans and efi. im very fond of it. not quite as strong as E4OD in stock configuration but decent none the less

the 4r70w has a 'wide ratio' gears like the E4OD. the 4r70w is based from AOD and E4OD basedfrom C6. meaning lower 1st and bit lower 2nd but shallower OD ratios than the predecessors (not that C6 had OD). the shallower OD helps prevent bogging the engine by dropping the RPMs too much when in OD

since you probably want 4x4, you need to find a 4x4 trans. i find that Explorers are a cheap source of used trans. jsut look for a AWD 5.0 Explorer.

the nice thing about the 4r70w is with the right year and the inexpensive JMod, they can handle a good amount of power and work great. you want to find a 98 or newer trans because they redesigned the trans and made them alot stronger. the Jmod is actually backed by Ford and is basically like doing a shift kit. it is said that 97 and older trans with Jmod can handle about 350hp. the 98 and newer with Jmod can handle up to 500hp. but that's like saying at what HP a 302 splits the block, it can vary on alot.

can always do a 'full manual' conversion on the 4R70W and use a floor shifter for a clutchless manual transmission feel lol. but thats not nearly as streetable
 

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Veering to the left a bit, have you considered putting an air-fuel gauge on the truck and tuning the carb? I think you’ll find lots of internet stories about significant MPG gains especially after getting the cruise speed AF lined out. And you may have a buyer lined up for your gauge set after you’re done (y).
 
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