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I got a set of 10" JL Audios hooded to an old school Orion HCCA 250 amp in a box I made. If I hooked the subs to their own sub I should not hear anything out of them but bass, right? If I turn down the other speakers so just the subs are playing I can hear other sounds through them. Granted they are faint but I thought that nothing but bass should come through them. I was thinking of getting a low pass crossover for the subs. That should fix it.....right?
 

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r u smoking crack dude? who told u to wire it like that? use the one on the right.

what exactly is the "other" noise your hearing? you shouldnt have nething over 200hz coming from your subs. likewise, you shouldnt have nething under 200hz from your full range speakers.
 

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miketrains03 said:
r u smoking crack dude? who told u to wire it like that? use the one on the right.
it isn't that crazy. that is wirred in parrallel, with the amp bridged. it eliminates the stereo aspect, which is dumb for subs anyways. it also lowers the impedence of the two subs. effectively you can get more power from your amp this way, but you really need to look into the ohm ratings of your amp along with the resistance of speakers and the power .
 

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I'm with zach on this one.
 

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NDIXIE said:
hold no guys, I never said I was a installer by no means. That is why this site is here I thought.:shrug :shrug

Thanks anyway for letting me know how dumb I am. :twotu: I will fix it.
I would not rewire crap yet. You need to do a little research first. Depending on what generation of that amp you have, it may or may not be bridgeable. If it is bridgeable (will have a mono switch on it in later gens), then not only can you bridge it, but IIRC it puts out around 800 Watts x1 @ 1 ohm. And if your subs can handle that level of output, then don't listen to these guys (except Zach) because the diagram on the left is EXACTLY how you want to wire it inside your box so you don't have to run 2 wires out of the box - Parallel - with the postive hooked to the positive on one channel and the negative hooked to the negative on the OTHER channel. There should be a small marking stating Bridge with a line showing which positive and negative.

Can you tell me a little more about your subs - which model JL's do you have? Are they Dual Voice Coil (2 sets of connectors on each sub) or Single? Do you happen to know the Ohm load for each sub?

Look at your amp and see what it says and what features it has to determine generation. It should have a gain control and a crossover that allows you to Low Pass Filter (LPF) it to only allow low hertz tones to pass. Right now it sounds like you have it on Full Pass - which is all Hz levels. I would recommned putting it around 80 hz with the LPF on. Most subs function best between 30-70 hz. Definitely keep it under 150 hz.

If it does not have a built in crossover, what headunit are you using? Does it have a built in sub preamp out and crossover for the preamp out?

If not, instead of building a low pass filter, just get a pair of these and put them on the rca line going into your amp:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=266-254

They act as an LPF and remove the signal above the selected level before it is amplified - which is the preferred method instead of using a passive crossover or LPF in the speaker line. Plus, You can pick the Hz level, when you purchase them, they are removeable if you get a better amp, and don't have a ohm resistance issue or total power maximum like most passive crossovers or inline LPF's will.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Well, I bought the amp from a guy at Ft Benning when I was stationed there. I don't think he bought the amp (burned my hands,lol). Anyway, there was no place to wire the amp. I took it to a stereo shop and he soldered some wire for the outputs. The amp does not have a mono button. I have not seen any marking for a bridge.
The subs are sigle voice coil. I will have to remove one and check the omhs.
It does have a gain control I don't know about a built in crossover.
The head unit does not anything for a sub. I had to use Y's on the RCA jacks on the head unit.
Believe it or not I was looking those F-Mod's but did not know which hz to get. I will get the. I found some on Ebay for like $27.50 and on Crutchfield for around $30. I like the price on the one you show.
I know I have not given you that much info. but I will see what I can find and get more info. I still may not have it wire right. It does not seem to be pushing the subs. THAT hard. I was told this amp was a beast back in its day. I hope the LPFs helps.
 

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theres only two ways to wire two svc subs to one amp; either parallel or series. lets assume their 4 ohm svc subs and a 300 watt @ 4 ohms rated sub capable of 2, 4, or 8 ohms.

parallel- one wire from positive of amp to positive of each sub and one wire from negative of amp to negative of each sub. this would make the subs into an 8 ohm load reducing power to 150 watts but increasing clarity.


series- one wire from positive of amp to positive of one speaker, one wire from negative of that speaker, to positive of second speaker, one wire from negative of second speaker to negative of amp. this would make the subs into a 2 ohm load doubling power to 600 watts but reducing clarity.

i believe that wiring setup you have there is a bootlegg version of a parallel setup. its not your fault, anybody could have done that without knowing otherwise. if ur used to normal wiring, it could look like a waste of wire to have them both connected to the same source like that.

personally, a range from 2-4 ohms is ideal for cars and a range from 4-8+ ohms for homes.

read up on the piles of info on www.crutchfield.com and im sure you'll enhance your stereo knowledge.
 

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miketrains03 said:
i believe that wiring setup you have there is a bootlegg version of a parallel setup. its not your fault, anybody could have done that without knowing otherwise. if ur used to normal wiring, it could look like a waste of wire to have them both connected to the same source like that.
it is the same thing. the positive on the amp is the same node as the positive on the speaker if they are already connected by a wire. the way his is wired is nice if you have 2 speakers in a box and the amp mounted seperately. that way you only have 2 wires between the amp and box.
 

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NDIXIE said:
another question, which way is the best to wire two subs. I wired mine like the pic on the left. I was thinking it should be like the one on the right though.

Both of the pictures are in paralell. The only difference is that the pic to the left the wires going from the amp to the first speaker is taking the load for both speakers. The one on the right each wire is taking the load for each speaker.
 

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miketrains03 said:
theres only two ways to wire two svc subs to one amp; either parallel or series. lets assume their 4 ohm svc subs and a 300 watt @ 4 ohms rated sub capable of 2, 4, or 8 ohms.

parallel- one wire from positive of amp to positive of each sub and one wire from negative of amp to negative of each sub. this would make the subs into an 8 ohm load reducing power to 150 watts but increasing clarity.


series- one wire from positive of amp to positive of one speaker, one wire from negative of that speaker, to positive of second speaker, one wire from negative of second speaker to negative of amp. this would make the subs into a 2 ohm load doubling power to 600 watts but reducing clarity.

i believe that wiring setup you have there is a bootlegg version of a parallel setup. its not your fault, anybody could have done that without knowing otherwise. if ur used to normal wiring, it could look like a waste of wire to have them both connected to the same source like that.

personally, a range from 2-4 ohms is ideal for cars and a range from 4-8+ ohms for homes.

read up on the piles of info on www.crutchfield.com and im sure you'll enhance your stereo knowledge.
You have the ohms load BACKWARDS. Parallel is postive to positive as you said, but it REDUCES the ohm load in half - 2 4 ohms wired in parallel is a 2 ohm load.

Series is postive to negative and doubles the ohm load - 2 4 ohms would be 8 ohms.

Here are wiring diagrams you can reference:

http://www.crutchfieldadvisor.com/ISEO-rgbtcspd/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?view=all

And ohm load does not affect distortion levels (clarity) in any way. Logically, if it did, the lower the resistance (lower ohms), you would think the lower the distortion.

However, bridging the amp will affect your distortion. It will double it since THD is measured per channel and you are combining 2 channels into one, thus doubling output and THD. Of course, most amps have THD levels below .10% and thus doubling it is still well below the audible levels of the human ear. So you won't notice.
 

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NDIXIE said:
Well, I bought the amp from a guy at Ft Benning when I was stationed there. I don't think he bought the amp (burned my hands,lol). Anyway, there was no place to wire the amp. I took it to a stereo shop and he soldered some wire for the outputs. The amp does not have a mono button. I have not seen any marking for a bridge.
The subs are sigle voice coil. I will have to remove one and check the omhs.
It does have a gain control I don't know about a built in crossover.
The head unit does not anything for a sub. I had to use Y's on the RCA jacks on the head unit.
Believe it or not I was looking those F-Mod's but did not know which hz to get. I will get the. I found some on Ebay for like $27.50 and on Crutchfield for around $30. I like the price on the one you show.
I know I have not given you that much info. but I will see what I can find and get more info. I still may not have it wire right. It does not seem to be pushing the subs. THAT hard. I was told this amp was a beast back in its day. I hope the LPFs helps.
Basically, most generations of that amp were RMS rated at 200 x1 @ 4 ohms, 400 x1 @ 2 ohms, and 800x1 @ 1 ohm bridged. So yes, it is a beast in a small package. That is definitely one of the old school classics.

The question is what RMS watts level can your subs handle and what the ohm load for each sub is. Most SVC subs are either 2 or 4 ohm (4 being most popular). JL made the full range from 2 - 8 depending on model, so that is really an important thing to find out.

Lets assume you have 4 ohm SVC's. If you wire them parallel, you will be a 2 ohms. That will give you and RMS of 400x1 on that amp. If the subs you have are JL 10w0-10w2, then you need to watch your gains because they are all rated at under 150 RMS/sub and you can blow them at 200/channel. However, if they are 10w3's or above, you just need to ensure the amp is not clipping when you set the gain because the subs can handle all that amp has to give.

Do you know the preamp volt output for your headunit? If not, do you know the model of your headunit? This will effect your gain level setting. Basically, your gain setting is not a volume level as most people think. It is a input sensitivity adjustment. Meaning, if you have an HU that puts out 8 preamp volts, then you don't have to have the gain as high to get the full watts from your amp as you do if you have a preamp output of 2 volts. 2 volts is common in older and entry level HU's. If you turn the gain up to high in relation to your preamp output, you will cause clipping and introduce distortion.
 

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NDIXIE said:
what is the differenc in this pic and the pic on the left on my first post?

None. I was just showing you that you were right before you started rewiring stuff. Both of the diagrams you had originally showed parallel wiring configurations.

As Shadow said, the only difference is where the ohm load distributes. The advantage of your current wiring configuration is you only have to run a single set of wires into the box and then attach the other sub to the first, instead of having 2 entering the box.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Well I got it....I must have did something wrong. I went back to check what kind of subs I have and seen the mistake. Anyway it hits hard now:rockon I have got to get those LPFs thought, since my amp has no mono setting. That should make them sound even better.

By the way, I will prob rebuild my box. I have a buddy who is going to get me a copy of Bass Box 6 Pro for "free".
 

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NDIXIE said:
Well I got it....I must have did something wrong. I went back to check what kind of subs I have and seen the mistake. Anyway it hits hard now:rockon I have got to get those LPFs thought, since my amp has no mono setting. That should make them sound even better.

By the way, I will prob rebuild my box. I have a buddy who is going to get me a copy of Bass Box 6 Pro for "free".
Glad it is working. Just out of curiosity, do you have each sub wired to its own channel or both wired to one channel? Did you determine what model sub you have?

If you are going to rebuild your box, then I would suggest going ported if you want more performance. If you look up your sub on JLaudio.com it will give you the TS parameters, sub displacement, etc. you need for BB6 Pro.

Don't go by what JL says for box size - use the size BB6 tells you. All manufacturers go smaller than optimal so they don't scare people off. Because most people don't want to give up their entire trunks or rear cargo areas for a sub box.

Also, I would suggest using Precision Sound Products flared ports for porting. The flared ends and overall design of the round ports can get you a huge db gain over a typical slot or square port. As much as 3 db's, which is the equivalent of doubling your wattage output.
 

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