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Discussion Starter #1
Hey so I have bassically zero experience with tuning Efi engines. Does anybody recommend a mail order tune? Or should I go with a tweecer and hope I figure it out? Lol. Here's what I have going on.

95 f150 4x4 started life as a 5.0 mass air truck. It's getting a 5.8 swap I just rebuilt the engine it's a 5.8 roller block, comp 35 349 8 cam, edelbrock performer heads, edelbrock intake, and all the normal bolt on ignition and exhaust stuff whenever I get the engine in the truck, And 24lb injectors. I don't have the money for a dyno tune so which tuner option do you all think will be right?
 

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Tweecer is dying. Get a quarterhorse and Binary Editor and it does more for less too. However tuning is an art which requires loads of time, practice, and patience.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
So you think I would be better off with a quarter horse then a mail order tune or a tweecer? Does quarter horse give a good base tune or something I can drive the truck with and just make changes as I need them?
 

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Tweecer is dying. Get a quarterhorse and Binary Editor and it does more for less too. However tuning is an art which requires loads of time, practice, and patience.
:doh0715: Tweecer is not dying! :twak In fact there are many more options now.

He could have a basic tune for his rig made on a chip for plug and play. He could get that basic tune on the base unit and be able to make changes as he learns, he could get an RT which allows for datalogging, he could get a dealer package, learn how to tune and burn chips himself.

Option here: http://www.tweecer.com/index.htm

For most folks who don't want to climb the steep learning curve for tuning and who are not planning to continue to make changes in their build, I recommend a plug and play chip with a tune for your build. The long time tuner and owner, Mike Glover will cut you a plug and play chip for $225for your build that will make it run great. In this case, it's not a complicated build which could require datalogging and more tuning to get it right.
 

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Swat that is good info, I am in a similar situation and that looks like it is a good way to go. I currently have an SCT eliminator chip installed with a tune, that I do not think is very good (due to wide band reading and general drivability). I was planning on getting that chipped re-burned at a dyno but looks like for the same money (or less) I could get a close tune and the software to edit it myself as I see fit.

Also rockchopper, I have the same engine as you will be swapping in, almost, I have afr instead of edelbrock heads. I am happy with how mine runs though I do think it will benefit from a good tune. What made you want to go with the 24lb injectors over say 30's? If mine doe send up on the dyno I will be sure to post up some info on what the numbers were and that. Its looking like the spring time for me to get that done.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
So you think I only need the 225 doller option from tweecer? I wish either tweecer or quarter horse came with base tunes that didn't add so much to the cost I'd like to have the ability to adjust stuff but I don't really wanna learn how to tune this stuff on my new engine. Lol.
 

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So you think I only need the 225 doller option from tweecer? I wish either tweecer or quarter horse came with base tunes that didn't add so much to the cost I'd like to have the ability to adjust stuff but I don't really wanna learn how to tune this stuff on my new engine. Lol.
I have always played with my daily driver and needed a base tune to get on the road ASAP. I started with the base unit and a driveway tune for a blown 302 Bronco. There is so much you can learn with a Tweecer if you get a base unit with base/driveway tune. You can compare two tunes so can see easily the changes from the stock tune and driveway tune. Everything you need, software, device, Strategy, and support web site come with it. You can upgrade to an RT and wideband O2 sensor later if you want to learn more. The RT allows you to datalog and tune to what it is actually doing. I enjoyed learning and Tweecing, although I didn't improve much on the base tune..................

I got a post here on tuning the transmission which was fun!
 

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$375 gets you the base unit and a base tune to plug-in and play!

I got to add here that most tuner type folks are looking for every single pony which can change even with the weather and altitude, but that is not necessary to have a damn fine running combo.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Swat that is good info, I am in a similar situation and that looks like it is a good way to go. I currently have an SCT eliminator chip installed with a tune, that I do not think is very good (due to wide band reading and general drivability). I was planning on getting that chipped re-burned at a dyno but looks like for the same money (or less) I could get a close tune and the software to edit it myself as I see fit.

Also rockchopper, I have the same engine as you will be swapping in, almost, I have afr instead of edelbrock heads. I am happy with how mine runs though I do think it will benefit from a good tune. What made you want to go with the 24lb injectors over say 30's? If mine doe send up on the dyno I will be sure to post up some info on what the numbers were and that. Its looking like the spring time for me to get that done.
I actually haven't baught the injectors yet so Im open to either 24 or 30, it's all built except I still need the intake and injectors. Do you have the same cam as me too? How do you like it got any video of it running or you driving it posted anywhere?

So if I baught the tunable tweecer non rt model would that do the trick? Anybody in jersey wanna help me tune it? Lol. I wonder if someone on here has a tune they really like and the same setup as me so I could just copy most of it to start with.
 

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I do have the same cam. There is some video of it idling in my build thread but I do not have any of it driving (look for the 92 bronco though it is in my 78's build thread) I have only put 350 miles on it since it was put in so don't really have a good opinion of it yet. It does feel a lot better then the 250k mile 351 it replaced though. I got the engine done and am now working on the interior and the rear axle, also re-gearing to 4.10's, at the same time I lowered down to a 4" lift to run 33" tires. The little bit I have drove it, it did run really well. Good torque everywhere, at least the bit I have driven it.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Ok im gonna revisit this sense im finally almost at the point of ordering something. I am leaning towards the base tweeker and the base tune (I thaught I had a place I was gonna get a mail order tune from but I'm losing confidence in him and luckily he has zero dollars from me) . A couple more questions how dialed in can you get the trans with this? I was gonna get a transgo kit or something but could I get it there just with the tweecer? Also can anyone think of any reason to go mail order tune over a tweecer base considering I know nothing about tuning Efi? Just to throw it in what's the best budget mass air setup to go along with this? Thanks guys.
 

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Definitely get something that will allow you to change the tune if you want. That's just my opinion, but in the long run it will be worth it assuming you have a sufficient comprehension of mechanical, electrical and computer stuff to learn the craft. There is a fairly steep learning curve, but you will be surprised how quickly you climb it and there is a LOT of help out there.

I have had really good results from the guys at Core Tuning. www.coretuning.net. I do not use either a QH or a Tweecer since I run a '96 (OBDII). I use a Mongoose cable to ref lash the PCM.

Good luck,

Baxter
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Ya im fairly certain I'm gonna go ahead with the tweecer.
 

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I do not use either a QH or a Tweecer since I run a '96 (OBDII). I use a Mongoose cable to ref lash the PCM.


Baxter
Why did you go this route and not a SCT that most dyno tuners/shops use?
 

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Why did you go this route and not a SCT that most dyno tuners/shops use?
I actually started with the SCT. In fact, if anyone is in the market for the SCT Pro Racer Software and the dongle for the AGANF strategy, they can have it cheap from me. Unfortunately, the SCT Pro Racer is a little bit neutered and would not do all the things I needed it to do. Specifically, I do not run a distributor. I am running an EDIS-8 module on a supercharged 351W. That requires a 36-1 crankshaft sensor ring on the harmonic balancer. The '96 5.8 engines use a 4 point crankshaft senor ring on the balancer for OBDII misfire detection. You can easily put the 36-1 ring from a 5.0 explorer on the '96 5.8 balancer. It presses right on in place of the 4 point ring. However, you then lose the misfire detection sensor and will throw a code. The AGANF strategy I got from Adam at Pop's Racing has all of the parameters I need to turn off the misfire detection so I can use the 36-1 ring and not throw any codes.

The SCT strategy allowed me to tune fuel and spark, but it was not NEARLY as feature rich as using Binary Editor and Adam's AGANF strategy. Plus, the support from Adam and Clint (core tuning) is without equal.

The SCT software requires you to also have some SCT hardware to download the tune to and then you use that hardware to flash the PCM. That SCT hardware is VIN locked to one PCM. The Mongoose cable just flashes the PCM directly from Binary Editor through the OBDII port. It's very slick and I can flash all the AGANF PCMs I want with it (though I am just tuning mine).

Baxter
 

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that's good info and i will look into the system a bit more, but i plan on staying NA for now so i doubt i would need that much work. on a side note, would it be worth getting the tuner before i build using updated software on mostly stock components then change the tune when the block is built? is there any gains to be found in a tune for a stock 5.8 with edelbrock intake and bassani exaust? maybe just a before and after comparison?
 

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I'm going to say that if you are running the stock injectors and stock MAF sensor, you should be OK with the stock tune. I am running a supercharger with a 90mm lightning MAF and 80# injectors. I'd be surprised if I could even get the motor started with the stock tune.

The factory PCM is calibrated to the MAF and injectors in the truck. The PCM will read the amount of air coming in and tell the injectors to spit out the right amount of fuel. The reason you need a tune on these motors is if you make enough changes that the computer can no longer calculate the proper A/F ratio.

When you do start tuning it yourself, you will need a wideband O2 sensor. With the wideband O2, you basically play hit and miss until you get the calibration of the MAF sensor and injectors close enough that the A/F ratio the computer calls for it basically gets. Then, you turn everything back over to that Ford PCM to run the motor. If you get it close enough, the PCM will fine tune itself over time.

Once you get enough power adders that you swap in bigger injectors, you will pretty much have to start tuning. Until then, you would probably not see much, if any, improvement from a tune.

Baxter
 
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