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Discussion starter · #21 ·
So in talking with Diesel Conversion Specialists, there is a common vacuum pump/power steering pump all in one unit I need to get (they offer it, too) that is turned by the timing gears. So I'm going to order one of those. The conversion kit I got from them is supposed to include fittings to adapt the power steering and vacuum pump to the brake booster and my steering.
 
Have you already bought all that's on the list?
Few questions -
1. What fuel plate you plan to use?
2. Are you replacing stock head bolts with ARP? (Have not seen this listed.)
3. What turbo size you are going to use?
4. Why you have external oil filter for?
5. Why do you have that in cabin fuel regulator?
6. What lift pump you put in?
7. What additional gauges you going to have? (ETG, Boost, Dual intake temp, Fuel pressure, tranny temp)
8. What is your tranny? Is it E4OD that was in your BKO and you just got it beefed up?
9. That labor cost is that to pay the shop to do entire conversion?
10. Why you bought new fuel tank for? old works just fine if cleaned (unless your is rusted.)
11. What size of fuel lines you running?
12. The intercooler..? There's more effective and lot cheaper way.
That vacuum/power steering pump combo is from 6BT. It is not going to fit under your P pump. You need to use external canister in order to fit.
Milan
 
Have you already bought all that's on the list?
Few questions -
That vacuum/power steering pump combo is from 6BT. It is not going to fit under your P pump. You need to use external canister in order to fit.
Milan
I used the 6bt pump in mine just had to put a small dent in the corner to make it fit. - Sorry this is wrong I can't figure out how to line through it. My builder used the 6bt internals and a chevy minivan canister lol

My PPump engine w/ that same CPL came w/ an inter-cooler. I have the HX30 turbo. Do you have the engine in your possession already?
 
Discussion starter · #24 · (Edited)
I have added the "My 4bt Configuration" section and filled it with info. I have a ton more than what's in the OP, but I plan to keep adding little by little each day. It's just a pain to organize what I have coherently and rewrite it.

I actually wasn't sure about vacuum, honestly I didn't know much about it and how important it was for braking until last week @texaswoodswalker893. DCS let me know the Sandon power steering pump and vacuum pump assembly from the 6bt's of 93-97 would work on this engine, and that's how I planned to get vacuum. I was hoping that I had that assembly already, but based off the pictures I took last week, I'm going to go out on a limb and say I don't have a vacuum pump, and might have a power steering pump.

I've already bought a vast majority of what's on the list @milan65. I thought about marking the ones I bought, but It is most of it, including the intercooler.
  1. So Power Driven Diesel, the guys I bought the Live AFC from, told me I wouldn't need to grind down the fuel plate to allow more fuel with the Live AFC system. Bonus, I can change my power on the fly with the live system.
  2. I did not plan to replace the stock head bolts. Should I with 200hp? What I was reading was, unless I plan to go much higher than that, I shouldn't have to worry just yet about it. But I'm not overly experienced in these matters.
  3. I am using an HX30. From what I'm reading, I'm hoping that should be sufficient?
  4. One of my must-haves is AC, and the Diesel Conversion Specialists kit can have a high-mount AC bracket added that will mount a Dodge compressor. Unfortunately, the mount necessitates the remote oil filter kit, according to DCS.
  5. I plan to travel a lot between sea level and 6000+ elevation semi-regularly. PDD convinced me (suckered me into believing?) it would be useful to have to adjust power with drastic elevation changes like that.
  6. A lift pump wasn't on my radar.. unless that's the fuel pump?
  7. I got a three-pod pillar for EGT, boost, and tranny temp, and the accompanying gauges.
  8. It's an E4OD. I found out through research a 4r100 is not that differnt, and used in the 1999-2003 super duty's. Local transmission shop who's don this before is putting all the steel internals in the E4OD in place of the alloy parts to make it good for around 1000lb-ft tq. I believe there was mention of changing to a dual-clutch torque converter for the powerstrokes as well. The E4OD doesn't come with a temp sensor, but I plan to put one into the test port.
  9. Yes it is, and it's not complete. That is the deposit.
  10. This is a really long story I'll eventually post in the OP, but to keep it short: I wanted a new truck bad but refuse to pay the price. So I'm going hard on this build to make me feel like I have a new truck to scratch that itch, and still save tons of money by not paying for a brand new truck. My tank is original and I wanted to change to a plastic one because it won't rust. I'm protecting it with a 1/4" aluminum skid plate.
  11. I honestly have no idea. I spoke with the shop and they said they are going to fabricate them in house out of stainless I believe.
  12. Yeah, honestly this purchase hurt my soul, and also, my luck, it's not in stock, so I have to wait a bit. I wanted the process to be mostly bolt-on so I can do my own work down the road if I have to. Swapping in an f350 core support and radiator, and that kit claims to be bolt on in front of the radiator. Also it appears bigger than cheaper kits, and the chief complaint I saw about 4bter's and their power was having a too-small intercooler.
The vacuum/power steering pump from the 93-97 Rams won't work? DCS told me the Sandon branded one would? Although their engine did have a VE pump... What do you mean by an external canister?

@curtwow I do, here are some pictures of parts and the engine:

Just getting back from picking up the engine
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Dropped it off at the shop
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Aluminum fuel tank skid plate
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Gauge pod and gauges
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Plastic fuel tank
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A lift pump pulls fuel from the tank and pushes it to the injection pump. That p-pump really has no way to pull fuel all the way from the tank. All it does is make pressure. So the lift pump will supply fuel to the p-pump.

I'm not a fan of dodge or most of their parts so if I was doing this swap I would just run an electric vacuum pump under the hood and not worry about it.

The AFC live is an awesome tool. Adjusting power is really the end result of what it does. It controls the amount of fuel injected. At altitude the air is thinner than at sea level so your sea level tuned engine will see less boost which will cause you to blow black smoke. The PDD guys aren't fans of black smoke on daily drivers. That's why they told you you needed that.

200hp is getting close to pushing a 4bt. But as long as you're not towing heavy up steep grades or throwing compounds on it or drag racing it, you shouldn't NEED head studs. However, they won't hurt anything and it's no extra labor to install them. Also installing them now would "future proof" the engine if you decide you want more power later on.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
 
Seems like you already bought most of what’s on your list. So for all these items there’s no need to go over it and discuss the importance or need (to have it installed). Let’s focus on items from your list you don’t have yet.
  • ARP head studs – since your plan is to reach 200hp, these are pretty much mandatory.
  • Even though you already have turbo, is it stock or is it bigger one like 44mm? If you want to get 200hp you need super turbo or 44mm.
  • Fuel pump is usually inside the gas tank. 4BT has lift pump. It is recommended to get one that generates higher pressure then stock one.
  • Intercooler – seems like you have not bought it yet. If you can - cancel the order. Go to www.frozenboost.com and buy their 600HP kit. Select Bosh pump and type 118 radiator. Their system is far less expensive and much more efficient and power full then air to air system you are buying. The installation is NOT bolt on, but once done it allows you to manage the system based on ambient temp especially if you decide to monitor intake temp before and after turbo.
  • Vacuum system – the vacuum/power steering pump combo from 6BT with external reservoir is preferred way. You need vacuum not only for your brakes since you decide to stay with stock vacuum brakes but also for heating & A/C that is operated based on vacuum system.
BTW the pictures you posted – for some reason they don’t show.
Let me know if you have any questions.
Milan
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
Man you have a lot of info, thanks for all the information!
  • I'll look at getting the ARP head studs here asap, they're tearing the motor apart today, but I think they weren't going to go as far as pulling the head.
  • The turbo I have is stock, an HX30 model. Is that the size of the turbine? I'll do some more research.
  • The Bronco's fuel pump is in the tank, I figured I wasn't going to need that anymore because of the P7100 on my 4bt. Am I misunderstanding something?
  • I'll do more research on the water to air cooler, it looks interesting and definitely cheaper.
  • Is it the reservoir that gets in the way of the ppump? Some other folks were saying the power steering and vacuum combo wouldn't fit with the ppump.
 
Discussion starter · #28 · (Edited)
It looks like there is already a lift pump on the 4bt, so that's good. One less thing I'll have to buy. They are looking to do a majority of the work on the Bronco this week so I'm getting the last of the parts ordered today. Then I'll add some more info to my OP.
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Hello,

  1. Turbo - you need bigger one then stock HX30. Get super turbo or 44mm. 44mm is the size of turbine.
  2. Stock fuel pump on Bronco that is in your fuel tank now is useless and needs to be removed. The lift pump on 4BT needs to be able to create higher fuel pressure than stock pump. The entire fuel delivery system is very sensitive. Absolutely no leaks. If both lines are not adequate engine starve and will not run good. I had to install fuel sump at the bottom of the tank with check valve in order to make it work. The lift pump could not ‘suck” the fuel from top of the tank. After manually sucking it up the engine eventually started but after shutting it off the fuel dropped back into the tank and could not start again. That’s why the check valve was installed at the tank to hold the fuel in line. Spent several weekends trying to figure it out with all different options.
  3. Aftercooler – It can be added at later stage once you have all other parts working. Water to air is superior option to air to air system with added flexibility to change the water flow and/or speed of fans on radiator to further improve the effectiveness in relation to ambient temperature. For example - if you drive in cold weather there’s no need to have that system to run on 100% compare to say driving in dead heat summer in AZ with ambient temp well over 100F. With air to air system, there’s no maintenance needed, but there’s nothing that can be done to adjust its effectiveness on the fly.
  4. Power steering 6BT combo – yes the reservoir gets in the way of the P pump. Solution is to get external reservoir from GM Astro minivan and replace the reservoir on the pump with the one that is designed for external one. However there are successful write-ups on 4BTSwaps where the filler neck of stock 6BT pump was saw-off and re-welded back on an angle that clears the bottom of the pump. However with external reservoir it can be mounted anywhere (kind of) for better access to fill it up. With reservoir on the pump it will be buried pretty low underneath your accelerator cable and hard to reach.
Let me know if you have more questions. Milan
 
Discussion starter · #31 · (Edited)
Ok, sorry it took a bit. Crazy busy.
  1. I amend my statement, I have an HX30W. I'm not sure if that makes a difference. I don't have enough in the budget for a bigger turbo at the moment, but I'll put it on the list of things to do in the near future.
  2. I'm looking now at lift pumps, and I'm thinking I might go with this [link]. Any thoughts? I'd prefer mechanical over electric, but it doesn't seem like there are any mechanical options out there.
  3. I do like the idea of this. The intercooler is on the way, though, and I'm a bit wary of extra electrical systems. I think this'll be another thing to go on the near future list.
  4. I ended up going with a PSC power steering and remote reservoir kit [link] to avoid the having to cut and turn the fill neck on the can. Hopefully this will help avoid needing to do that.
Update:
Engine, transmission, exhaust, fuel tank, and other underbody stuff has been stripped out. Bronco is going to LineX either today or tomorrow for an undercarriage and frame coating. Hopefully that helps a little with road noise too. If not, I already have a ton of sound deadening stuff ready to go in once I get her back.​
If anyone is interested in a newer AC compressor (<1yr old), Power Steering pump (<1yr old), serpentine belt (<5k miles) or anything else, let me know. Local pick up preferred, but we can work something out.​
Most of the new parts are on the table, all the old stuff pulled out is on the ground in front of and to the right of the table.​
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The old and (probably) tired 351w (~250k miles).​
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Discussion starter · #34 ·
That's not super great... I can see all of my pictures on a PC using Brave or Chrome. I haven't tried other browsers.

I did test and cannot see my pictures on a cell phone using brave or chrome, though. Are you using mobile @curtwow?
 
  1. I amend my statement, I have an HX30W. I'm not sure if that makes a difference. I don't have enough in the budget for a bigger turbo at the moment, but I'll put it on the list of things to do in the near future.
  2. I'm looking now at lift pumps, and I'm thinking I might go with this [link]. Any thoughts? I'd prefer mechanical over electric, but it doesn't seem like there are any mechanical options out there.
  3. I do like the idea of this. The intercooler is on the way, though, and I'm a bit wary of extra electrical systems. I think this'll be another thing to go on the near future list.
  4. I ended up going with a PSC power steering and remote reservoir kit [link] to avoid the having to cut and turn the fill neck on the can. Hopefully this will help avoid needing to do that.
Update:



Hello,

1. Turbo - in order to achieve 200HP + bigger turbo is a must. There's no way around.
2. Lift pump - even though electrical pumps are very attractive solution they are also expensive and their reliability is questionable. Just read some review to see for yourself. Usually they failed in the most unwanted situation leaving the driver stranded. Something that can be avoided by simply stick with mechanical pump. Here's the recommendation for reputable very good mechanical pump (I'm not associated with the seller in any way). I bought this pump from him and works flawlessly.
3. Power steering - The option you selected is very good and will work just fine. However there's far less expensive option available that will be equally good, unless you want to build fancy shiny show car to show it off. As mentioned before, Chevy Astro van reservoir from junk yard is $10. Brand new one from RockAuto is $35. The pump itself from RockAuto between $68-148 incl. core charge. You do not plan to run hydroboost so stock configuration will work just fine. Looks like you already bought PSC set, no need to expand on it.
This is just an observation and nothing else – You are spending a lot of money on items like PSC power steering pump, or the fuel regulator or fuel pump that are either not necessary or there’s less expensive solution that achieve the same or even better results. It’s your budget and your way of doing the swap. It is labor extensive job and the final cost just for the labor could be pretty high, unless you have some special arrangements (with the shop). It would be disappointing to see you have to put the project on hold because you exceeded your budget. This is in no way any criticism. I’m just trying to help.
BTW what’s your plan for gear ratio change?

Let me know if you have any questions. Milan

P.S. as mentioned before – I cannot see any of your pictures on Chrome browser on desktop PC.
 
Discussion starter · #39 ·
That's really interesting... I only did one thing different. I don't understand why it would matter. I will change the rest tonight or tomorrow so all the pictures are visible.

It appears google photos doesn't allow embedding pictures anywhere, even if it's a shared album or shared picture, unless the user viewing the picture is authenticated via google. Kind of lame. I think I found a way around that, but I'm also afraid there is some kind of caching happening to allow that one picture to be visible, and that a session will expire and the pictures will be unavailable again.

@milan65 if you notice that picture or the others (once I get them updated soon) disappear after you've been able to see them, can you let me know? I'll for sure have to move all the pictures to probably supermotors or something in that case.
 
Discussion starter · #40 · (Edited)
All images have been updated in replies and the OP. I will try to update the OP with more information Friday and/or this weekend.

Now that I've finally tracked down the issues with my posts (hopefully), here's a small update:

Engine mounts are stupid heavy.
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DCS Conversion kit for mating the 4bt to the e4od is in as well as the new transmission controller. Got some other major parts including power steering pump and reservoir, vacuum pump, block heater, and the core support with all needed mounting hardware. Looks like that'll have to get painted before going in. UPS was nice enough to ignore my note to put it in the driveway and I was surprised to find it blockading my egress.
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LineX is going to have to get skipped and done some other time, if at all. The shop that applies it is down a technician for sudden medical reasons and I'm trying to get this back on the road as quickly as possible. So bonus bay picture. That's a lot of space. I'm gonna need it...
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4bt is apart and ready for cleaning, paint, and upgrades. Those diesel piston heads sure are a funny shape. The shop fabbed up a quick stand to hold the block.
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Something pretty neat, I think this is the first thing I've ever seen stamped "Made In U.S.A".
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@milan65 I haven't forgotten about you. There isn't enough time in the day to do college, work, get to the shop, get pictures, research issues, troubleshoot the new forum posting weirdness, and catch up on posts. It'll be the death of me probably.
 
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